Profits Before Patients - A PBS Interview w/Bill Moyers

hiitdogs said:
That's not what it says, it talks about the financial responsibility (aka co-pay and deductible) of the patient to be determined in "real-time" - meaning right at the health care provider's office. It also lets you know if that specific provider is an in-network provider which comes in handy because for most insurance plans your copay for out of network providers is much higher. For that purpose a machine readable Healthcare ID card will be issued.

"(D) enable the real-time (or near real-time) determination of an individual's financial responsibility at the point of service, including whether the individual is eligible for a specific service with a specific physician at a specific facility which may include utilization of a machine-readable health plan beneficiary identification card.


The second part that you are referring to talks about enabling electronic funds transfers to allow for automated reconciliation. Right now we have a dinosaur system where payments are done by check
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Thank you Carola. I just don't want the government to have open access to my accounts without my permission and I don't want them taking money out of my account for a bill I may want to pay on time and not all at once.
As long as we would have a pin number or something and have a choice how to pay a bill.
 
baylian said:
EXACTLY > > > > I don't like that idea at all . . .

Just FWIW - The company my husband works for is small - probably 60 employees total and the CEO said that if this goes into effect then they will drop their insurance (which they pay $30000 a month for) and let everyone do on the government plan as it would be cheaper to pay the cost to do so. There will be many that go this and it won't be 45 million anymore but a much larger number.
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Actually there are provisions for assistance & tax credits for small business to prevent this very thing. If they employer chooses to opt out, they'll be required to contribute to the govmt plan.

http://pascrell.house.gov/views/Debunking Myths - 07.22.09.pdf

http://pascrell.house.gov/views/Summary.pdf

Unfortunately, my congressman's office couldn't download the full bill either. :( Lori, your link is only 167 pages, so I'm pretty sure that's not it. Why can I not get my hands on a copy of this thing? :mad:

Anyway, they gave me this link to a 35 page summary of the bill as well:

http://pascrell.house.gov/views/Section by Section.pdf
 
baylian said:
The point is that the amount of people going to government run program is going to swell beyond 45million . . .AND THERE IS NO MONEY TO DO THIS!!!!!

Do you really want the government that far up you arse???
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The Congressional Budget Office (CBO) does not support your position. It states the public option would result in 3 million more people enrolled in employer sponsered health care. The stats you are quoting come for a company called Lewin group which is a company owned by a health insurance company (United Health Care, I think). They obviously want to inflate the numbers to make it look like the public option is a bad idea. Not suprisingly, the health care insurance companies do not want any threat to their profits.
 
baylian said:
The fact that Obama is basically saying maybe a pill would have been the better idea. . .

Don't think for one minute that end of life issues are not going to be impacted by this.

Or the start of life either . . .
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The Hyde Amendment prohibits the use of public funds for abortion.
 
cockateils said:
Thank you Carola. I just don't want the government to have open access to my accounts without my permission and I don't want them taking money out of my account for a bill I may want to pay on time and not all at once.
As long as we would have a pin number or something and have a choice how to pay a bill.
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Ok you really need to check your facts; the government will not be just taking money out of your account without your permission. I posted a link earlier that debunks this lie.
 
LauraMax said:
Actually there are provisions for assistance & tax credits for small business to prevent this very thing. If they employer chooses to opt out, they'll be required to contribute to the govmt plan.

http://pascrell.house.gov/views/Debunking Myths - 07.22.09.pdf

http://pascrell.house.gov/views/Summary.pdf

Yes laura - it will be cheaper for many to contribute to the government plan.

My DH does the insurance for his company and he wants no part of this Obamacare . . .and our insurance is not that great anymore but it is the lesser of two evils in his eyes.
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I think the illegal immigrant issue is going to be the same as it is now. There's no "illegals get free health care" section but I also can't see hospitals starting to turn people away anymore than they do now. Hospitals shouldn't be a line of defense in this anyway. Illegal immigration should be dealt with at the borders not in the emergency rooms.
 
sparrow13 said:
I think the illegal immigrant issue is going to be the same as it is now. There's no "illegals get free health care" section but I also can't see hospitals starting to turn people away anymore than they do now. Hospitals shouldn't be a line of defense in this anyway. Illegal immigration should be dealt with at the borders not in the emergency rooms.
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Agreed. There needs to be comprehensive immigration reform.
 
baylian said:
The fact that Obama is basically saying maybe a pill would have been the better idea. . .

Don't think for one minute that end of life issues are not going to be impacted by this.

Or the start of life either . . .
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I listened to the entire thing and I didn't get that at all! I am not a huge Obama fan, and I didn't vote for him, but I absolutely didn't hear what you heard. It seemed to me as though he was just using that as a hypothetical in the case that she wasn't able to live through the surgery...

Which European countries with socialized health care have a say in how many children people can have, how they have to end their life or make their health decisions for them. Anyone know? Just curious :)

Melissa
 
From CMS at FreeRepublic.com:

• Page 16: States that if you have insurance at the time of the bill becoming law and change, you will be required to take a similar plan. If that is not available, you will be required to take the government option!
• Page 22: Mandates audits of all employers that self-insure!
• Page 29: Admission: your health care will be rationed!
• Page 30: A government committee will decide what treatments and benefits you get (and, unlike an insurer, there will be no appeals process)
• Page 42: The "Health Choices Commissioner" will decide health benefits for you. You will have no choice. None.
• Page 50: All non-US citizens, illegal or not, will be provided with free healthcare services.
• Page 58: Every person will be issued a National ID Healthcard.
• Page 59: The federal government will have direct, real-time access to all individual bank accounts for electronic funds transfer.
• Page 65: Taxpayers will subsidize all union retiree and community organizer health plans (example: SEIU, UAW and ACORN)
• Page 72: All private healthcare plans must conform to government rules to participate in a Healthcare Exchange.
• Page 84: All private healthcare plans must participate in the Healthcare Exchange (i.e., total government control of private plans)
• Page 91: Government mandates linguistic infrastructure for services; translation: illegal aliens
• Page 95: The Government will pay ACORN and Americorps to sign up individuals for Government-run Health Care plan.
• Page 102: Those eligible for Medicaid will be automatically enrolled: you have no choice in the matter.
• Page 124: No company can sue the government for price-fixing. No "judicial review" is permitted against the government monopoly. Put simply, private insurers will be crushed.
• Page 127: The AMA sold doctors out: the government will set wages.
• Page 145: An employer MUST auto-enroll employees into the government-run public plan. No alternatives.
• Page 126: Employers MUST pay healthcare bills for part-time employees AND their families.
• Page 149: Any employer with a payroll of $400K or more, who does not offer the public option, pays an 8% tax on payroll
• Page 150: Any employer with a payroll of $250K-400K or more, who does not offer the public option, pays a 2 to 6% tax on payroll
 
baylian said:
The fact that Obama is basically saying maybe a pill would have been the better idea. . .

Don't think for one minute that end of life issues are not going to be impacted by this.

Or the start of life either . . .
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What I heard is that President Obama said that in some cases a doctor may decide that a pill is better than surgery. Do you dispute that may be the case is some instances? He wasn't saying that in every case that would be better.

One of the current versions of the bills pass by the House states that Medicare can reimburse doctors for consulting with patients about things such as advance directives or living wills. The think most people don't understand is that a living will gives the patient a right to decide in advance what they want when they get ill and can no longer make that decision, i.e., does the patient want to be kept alive by artificial means. Personally, I'd like to make those decisions myself and not leave it up to doctors or my husband.

So unless you can point to another provision in any of the bills that deals with end of life issues, there is no support for your position.
 
baylian said:
From CMS at FreeRepublic.com:

• Page 16: States that if you have insurance at the time of the bill becoming law and change, you will be required to take a similar plan. If that is not available, you will be required to take the government option!
Click to expand...
We addressed that one a couple of pages back. :)

You can participate in any plan you like if you leave your current plan after the bill takes effect. The only difference is that new plans will be following the new regulations.

It sounds like we'll have a lot of choices actually.
 
Stacy said:
Beauracracy is ALREADY running the health care system! I work for a great group of doctors, who contrary to what alot of people believer are NOT out to make more money for themselves so they can buy fancy cars etc. Reimbursement is getting less and less and just to make payroll for employees and to pay bills...which are rising as fast as reimbursement is declining, ie. malpractice insurance is going up every year. This is forcing them to see more patients per hour just to make ends meet. And, believe me, this is NOT how they want to operate. They feel rushed, and feel like they arent doing as good a job as they should b/c they're being forced to handle one medical complaint per visit for the sake of time. One of the docs I work for has even taken out a personal loan just so she can pay us. And, no, she doesnt drive a BMW, she drives a beat up mini van. From my perspective, I spend half of my day on the phone trying to get prior authorization for medicine that the patient has been stable on for years b/c the insurance company suddenly doesnt want to cover it. That's time away from the patient care I should be doing. It's all quite insane. Health care reform cant come quick enough and the scare tactics are ridiculous and all at our expense...literally!
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I see two separate issues here:
1) tort reform may help decrease unwarranted lawsuits against Drs. -- this has been the case in states like Missouri where tort reform has reduced malpractice lawsuits. However, the cost of health insurance in Missouri is still rising significantly each year.

2) Health care insurance reform is needed to ensure that patients are not disadvantaged significantly (i.e. cheated) by the insurance companies that are completely incentivized to be profitable and give less and get more. These insurance companies affect patient care--how? they choose what they will and won't cover and how much they will cover and this can influence the treatment a patient chooses. A patient may have to pick the treatment they can afford in lieu of the 'ideal' treatment.

Tort reform helps doctors to keep costs down in their practices while healthcare insurance reform keeps companies from simply looking at profit and stacking the deck in their favor. Frankly, I appreciate Obama trying to be proactive here. If the previous administration had been as proactive with monitoring and protecting citizen from the banking industry perhaps the current economic situation would not have occurred.

just my 2 cents worth,
 
baylian said:
From CMS at FreeRepublic.com:

• Page 16: States that if you have insurance at the time of the bill becoming law and change, you will be required to take a similar plan. If that is not available, you will be required to take the government option!
• Page 22: Mandates audits of all employers that self-insure!
• Page 29: Admission: your health care will be rationed!
• Page 30: A government committee will decide what treatments and benefits you get (and, unlike an insurer, there will be no appeals process)
• Page 42: The "Health Choices Commissioner" will decide health benefits for you. You will have no choice. None.
• Page 50: All non-US citizens, illegal or not, will be provided with free healthcare services.
• Page 58: Every person will be issued a National ID Healthcard.
• Page 59: The federal government will have direct, real-time access to all individual bank accounts for electronic funds transfer.
• Page 65: Taxpayers will subsidize all union retiree and community organizer health plans (example: SEIU, UAW and ACORN)
• Page 72: All private healthcare plans must conform to government rules to participate in a Healthcare Exchange.
• Page 84: All private healthcare plans must participate in the Healthcare Exchange (i.e., total government control of private plans)
• Page 91: Government mandates linguistic infrastructure for services; translation: illegal aliens
• Page 95: The Government will pay ACORN and Americorps to sign up individuals for Government-run Health Care plan.
• Page 102: Those eligible for Medicaid will be automatically enrolled: you have no choice in the matter.
• Page 124: No company can sue the government for price-fixing. No "judicial review" is permitted against the government monopoly. Put simply, private insurers will be crushed.
• Page 127: The AMA sold doctors out: the government will set wages.
• Page 145: An employer MUST auto-enroll employees into the government-run public plan. No alternatives.
• Page 126: Employers MUST pay healthcare bills for part-time employees AND their families.
• Page 149: Any employer with a payroll of $400K or more, who does not offer the public option, pays an 8% tax on payroll
• Page 150: Any employer with a payroll of $250K-400K or more, who does not offer the public option, pays a 2 to 6% tax on payroll
Click to expand...

First of all, you don't state which bill this comes from. There are several versions; no final version has been reached.

Second, this is full of distortions and outright lies. Where is Acorn mentioned in any bill? Where does it say illegal alliens will be provided free health care? Where does it state the Govt. will have access to private bank accounts? I can answer that; nowhere. This is total B.S.

If you are really interested in knowing what's going on, read the bills. Relying on a FreeRepublic is not really helpful to the discussion.
 
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