Beavs
Cathlete
You can sell it, donate it, give it away, make a copy for your own personal use (as long as you don't sell it), loan it to a friend, burn it in your yard etc. Were it not for First Sale Doctrine libraries wouldn't even exist.
P90X/Ebay/Legal issues!!!
- Thread starter baylian
- Start date
You can sell it, donate it, give it away, make a copy for your own personal use (as long as you don't sell it), loan it to a friend, burn it in your yard etc. Were it not for First Sale Doctrine libraries wouldn't even exist.
Baylian, I sent you a pm already. Please let me know how else I can help.
To anyone else w/concerns, as was already posted here, YES, you have the right to re-sell your BB' products anywhere you like UNLESS you are a Coach. (Coaches can't legitimately use Ebay, Amazon, Craigslist to sell products, though some do.)
Beachbody fully acknowledges consumer's first sale doctrine rights--as they ought!!
It sounds like the law firm has been overzealous in their targeting and using a fine tooth comb where a wide tooth comb would be better. If anyone has issues or concerns about this, please contact me (pm is probably best given this is Cathe's forum).
Re: the youtube videos by the former Coach who had his business suspended (then cancelled) for repeatedly not following BB's Compliance Rules. He's a police officer and his first excuse for his repeated violations was he never read the rules? "Ignorance of the law is no excuse" is a basic tenet of law enforcement, isn't it.
Plus, he talked about "walking that edge" between legit & non-legit. I found it very interesting that again, a police officer was so willing to blur the line for his own self gain because he perceived that others were doing it & "it's business." I'm sure he would not have the same view of a criminal who had that same perspective on his/her activities.
So, no I'm not worried about whether BB has my back. I DID read the rules and I follow them. Maybe I don't make as much $$ as others who prefer to "walk the line" but $$ isn't my sole aim. I've met so many wonderful people thru Coaching and that's a valuable payoff all by itself.
I'm very sorry for what Baylian has been put thru and it should not have happened.
Have a great night everyone!
To anyone else w/concerns, as was already posted here, YES, you have the right to re-sell your BB' products anywhere you like UNLESS you are a Coach. (Coaches can't legitimately use Ebay, Amazon, Craigslist to sell products, though some do.)
Beachbody fully acknowledges consumer's first sale doctrine rights--as they ought!!
It sounds like the law firm has been overzealous in their targeting and using a fine tooth comb where a wide tooth comb would be better. If anyone has issues or concerns about this, please contact me (pm is probably best given this is Cathe's forum).
Re: the youtube videos by the former Coach who had his business suspended (then cancelled) for repeatedly not following BB's Compliance Rules. He's a police officer and his first excuse for his repeated violations was he never read the rules? "Ignorance of the law is no excuse" is a basic tenet of law enforcement, isn't it.
Plus, he talked about "walking that edge" between legit & non-legit. I found it very interesting that again, a police officer was so willing to blur the line for his own self gain because he perceived that others were doing it & "it's business." I'm sure he would not have the same view of a criminal who had that same perspective on his/her activities.
So, no I'm not worried about whether BB has my back. I DID read the rules and I follow them. Maybe I don't make as much $$ as others who prefer to "walk the line" but $$ isn't my sole aim. I've met so many wonderful people thru Coaching and that's a valuable payoff all by itself.
I'm very sorry for what Baylian has been put thru and it should not have happened.
Have a great night everyone!
Fitnessfreakk366
Cathlete
Baylian, I sent you a pm already. Please let me know how else I can help.
To anyone else w/concerns, as was already posted here, YES, you have the right to re-sell your BB' products anywhere you like UNLESS you are a Coach. (Coaches can't legitimately use Ebay, Amazon, Craigslist to sell products, though some do.)
Beachbody fully acknowledges consumer's first sale doctrine rights--as they ought!!
It sounds like the law firm has been overzealous in their targeting and using a fine tooth comb where a wide tooth comb would be better. If anyone has issues or concerns about this, please contact me (pm is probably best given this is Cathe's forum).
Re: the youtube videos by the former Coach who had his business suspended (then cancelled) for repeatedly not following BB's Compliance Rules. He's a police officer and his first excuse for his repeated violations was he never read the rules? "Ignorance of the law is no excuse" is a basic tenet of law enforcement, isn't it.
Plus, he talked about "walking that edge" between legit & non-legit. I found it very interesting that again, a police officer was so willing to blur the line for his own self gain because he perceived that others were doing it & "it's business." I'm sure he would not have the same view of a criminal who had that same perspective on his/her activities.
So, no I'm not worried about whether BB has my back. I DID read the rules and I follow them. Maybe I don't make as much $$ as others who prefer to "walk the line" but $$ isn't my sole aim. I've met so many wonderful people thru Coaching and that's a valuable payoff all by itself.
I'm very sorry for what Baylian has been put thru and it should not have happened.
Have a great night everyone!
Why can't coaches sell on ebay? I don't understand that rule.
Fembot40
Cathlete
Wow, I'm glad I saw this thread. I was thinking about purchasing the Insanity DVD's, but no way would I now! I hope people will stop purchasing their products until they get their law firm under control. Talk about gestapo!
I hope this has been posted over at Video Fitness forums.
I hope this has been posted over at Video Fitness forums.
baylian
Cathlete
I am not a member
at VF. But feel free to post the story, quotes or whatever. I never did hear back from the law firm either by phone or email. Hopefully they have gone away.
And the post I put on Tony Hortons Facebook Wall was removed after about two hours.
Here is the wording of the email (letter was an attachment)
Attached you will find a demand letter with corresponding enclosures which relate to your trademark and copyright infringement of P90X products. Please read these documents thoroughly as action is required on your part.
Product Partners, LLC is aggressively combating rampant piracy of its P90X products. Below you will find a link to our client’s video press release in relation to its piracy enforcement measures.
http://link.brightcove.com/services/player/bcpid15254013001?bctid=41933650001
You are hereby put ON NOTICE and should immediately CEASE AND DESIST from the sale of COUNTERFEIT P90X Products.
Sincerely,
Nora Ounjian
Paralegal
Johnson & Pham, LLP
6355 Topanga Canyon Blvd. Suite 115
Woodland Hills, CA 91367
(818) 888-7540 Telephone
(818) 888-7544 Facsimile
at VF. But feel free to post the story, quotes or whatever. I never did hear back from the law firm either by phone or email. Hopefully they have gone away.
And the post I put on Tony Hortons Facebook Wall was removed after about two hours.
Here is the wording of the email (letter was an attachment)
Attached you will find a demand letter with corresponding enclosures which relate to your trademark and copyright infringement of P90X products. Please read these documents thoroughly as action is required on your part.
Product Partners, LLC is aggressively combating rampant piracy of its P90X products. Below you will find a link to our client’s video press release in relation to its piracy enforcement measures.
http://link.brightcove.com/services/player/bcpid15254013001?bctid=41933650001
You are hereby put ON NOTICE and should immediately CEASE AND DESIST from the sale of COUNTERFEIT P90X Products.
Sincerely,
Nora Ounjian
Paralegal
Johnson & Pham, LLP
6355 Topanga Canyon Blvd. Suite 115
Woodland Hills, CA 91367
(818) 888-7540 Telephone
(818) 888-7544 Facsimile
baylian
Cathlete
If anyone wants
me to send them the entire letter I will be more than happy to do so. I attempted to copy and paste here but it did not work.
Please PM me and I will send in an attachment
Again - thanks everyone for listening and responding.
Beachbody is now off my list for ordering . . . .
me to send them the entire letter I will be more than happy to do so. I attempted to copy and paste here but it did not work.
Please PM me and I will send in an attachment
Again - thanks everyone for listening and responding.
Beachbody is now off my list for ordering . . . .
Miss Lee
Cathlete
Your post is still there (on Tony's fan page) -- I just read it about a minute ago. You've had one reply from another fan.
mspina
Cathlete
OMG!! I never knew this was the way beachbody works. So being a coach is essentialy being a salesperson. what a joke! no more beachbody for me. It must be know that beachbody has your back if you are selling their product
Joan did a great job of summing up my thoughts about the fired BB coach - he broke the rules, multiple times, and he knew he was pushing it all the while.
And yes, BB Coaches are the Mary Kay or Avon ladies of fitness products. Why is that a joke? It's a decent marketing approach for them, and a potentially great business opportunity for those who choose to pursue the opportunity.
DDRdiva
Cathlete
Probably because, as the guy said in the video, BB wants the name and contact info of everyone who buys their products, so they can shake them down later like they did with baylian. Ebay or other independent websites wouldn't funnel that info through to them.
I don't care how good the workouts are, I'm staying as far away as I can from that evil empire.
bonvivant
Cathlete
If you watched all 3 videos you will see he was terminated for doing something he was allowed to do. He got approval for the Ebay ad warning customers about bogus P90x products on Ebay. When told to take down the ad, he did.
His termination was beside the point. I wanted others to see what goes on inside the world of BB coaching. To see that the real goal of coaching is to get more coaches (thus more money for BB) not new customers. I wanted people to see that BB has not gotten better it's worse despite all their claims of wanting to create a "Fitness Revolution" in America. Sending C&D letters to genuine customers is further proof that this company does not care about its customers' or coaches' interests.
Did the BB coaches miss this? http://www.thecathenation.com/forum/showthread.php?t=255650
His termination was beside the point. I wanted others to see what goes on inside the world of BB coaching. To see that the real goal of coaching is to get more coaches (thus more money for BB) not new customers. I wanted people to see that BB has not gotten better it's worse despite all their claims of wanting to create a "Fitness Revolution" in America. Sending C&D letters to genuine customers is further proof that this company does not care about its customers' or coaches' interests.
Did the BB coaches miss this? http://www.thecathenation.com/forum/showthread.php?t=255650
Fitnessfreakk366
Cathlete
Where can I find Tony's fan page?
mspina
Cathlete
But at the end of the day, if none of the coaches have any customers, there is no money being made for anyone, so this doesn't really make any sense. This is NO different than any other network marketing opportunity, of which there are many (Mary Kay, Silpada jewelry, Creative Memories scrapbooking, Lia Sophia jewelry). They all have rules about how you can sell and how you can market. Is there a big "I hate Mary Kay" contingent around that I don't know about?
Well, I think there are some differences. For one, I almost always expect my fitness coach to be there for my fitness needs (which it sounds like the gentleman in the youtube vid is), not just to sell me stuff. And secondly, I would like to think my fitness coach is a coach who is in someway trained to do so, not trained to sell. So maybe they shouldn't be "coaches" but "consultants" like Mary kay.
Am I off base with this?? This whole post has been an eye opener to me.
mspina
Cathlete
Oh, I TOTALLY agree about the "coach" title - I think that was an incredibly poor decision, as it implies a level of competence or training that simply isn't a guarantee. Consultant would have been a *much* better choice of words when they originally launched this program!
I'm sure there are many BB coaches who are lousy, and only care about selling. I also know that there are many, many, many coaches who are incredibly caring and DO have a lot of fitness knowledge and work very hard to help their customers, regardless of how much money they end up bringing into them. Just like any business, there are some good people, and some not so good people.
WantFit
Cathlete
Totally agree. I think there is conflict of interests here. I don't doubt there are good coaches in BB. However, the way they put coaches as sales person, that is just like mutual fund managers tried to be financial advisors to sell their on products to people.
I think at least BB should make it loud and clear that their coaches are also sales person too.
bonvivant
Cathlete
Reposting part of Chris's post in case you missed it.
My concern about Beach Body's MLM program is a non-issue. You defending coaching and/or their products is against the rules. It doesn't matter if you make money or not.
Stephanie0523
Cathlete
Well, I hate that this has happened to a fellow Cathelete, but I have to speak up for Joan. I think it's unfair to lump all of the coaches together... Joan is a coach, and she's extremely respectful of Cathe and doesn't use the forums to sell. She's just a fellow Cathelete. I pm'd her asking for info. My experiences with Beachbody have been very good. No complaints. But I will be very careful in the future and will think twice about ordering from them and DEFINITELY won't sell the Beachbody items I have online just because of this lawsuit mess.
I will never buy anything from BB over this and other customer service issues. However, I agree with Stephanie that neither Joan nor mspina tries to sell BB producs on Cathe's forum. They contribute thoughtful posts to the discussion. I think that SNM's rule is to prevent people from coming to the forum and troll for business, which I don't think these two ladies do.