We're the Problem!?!?!

carres1973 said:
I have read the plan and it makes sense to me. My one concern, as is my concern with ALL politicians, is that this was a campaign plan and promise. Will he be able to stick to that plan/promise? All politicians promise the moon ("read my lips, no new taxes" comes to mind). However, many once they take office either conveniently forget or find that the plan isn't feasible or politically wise (repealing "don't ask, don't tell" as Obama promised). I would like "we the people" to ensure President Obama keeps Candidate Obama's promise to revamp the US healthcare industry. It is in dire need of an overhaul and I think the vast majority of Americans are looking for change.

Carrie
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Well, the problem is partisanship, & both sides are guilty of this. Someone will come up w/a real reform, then it'll get stonewalled in Congress, then it'll get watered down, then some pork'll get thrown in to get undecided reps to support it, & what we end up with is a 2000 page document that means nothing.

I love this country! :D:rolleyes::p
 
Gov'tgirl - I don't pay for my computer or services, I use a public computer. BTW - who pays $1000 for computer access anyway?
And don't forget, while you're contributed to the healthcare plan at work to pay for others, others are also paying for you.
The US has the highest infant mortality rates of any industrialized country. I think most of the people that oppose a universal health care plan, have never really had to worry about their health care costs. (or they choose to overlook where they have taken advantage of said programs). It's a bogey-man arguement.
 
Okay, I have a question for you educated ladies. :)

I have many qualms about big government in general, but one of my biggest concerns about health care being provided through a federal government is this: we are beyond a shadow of a doubt the most overweight and probably most medicated of the "civilized" nations on this planet. All of us know many people who are on something for diabetes, heart disease, cholesterol, etc. No other country with socialized medicine has patients that eat as horribly as Americans do. Our life expectancy and quality of life is going down. Doctors preach preventative care, but how many patients actually listen and practice good eating habits/exercise? How many people would rather just go on drugs to help their problem rather than change what they are doing? We here at this forum are in the the vast minority.

To me it seems counterproductive to provide health care for all (or at least the option) yet not do anything about how food is manufactured, what chemicals are added, how much sugar/HFCS is being added to things (like baby food!). Wouldn't continuing to allow this stuff to be put on the shelves of our supermarkets and paying for the medicine/surgeries/therapies to correct it eventually bankrupt us? I am very interested to hear others thoughts on this. DH and I have been talking about this a lot, and while it "sounds" good to have health care whenever you need it, with our current health situations and how the government seems to feel about food and treatments to diseases anyways it seems... self defeating? Shouldn't the problem of food be fixed before we start thinking about paying everyone's medication and doctor's visits?

Missy
 
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pink_fortitude said:
Okay, I have a question for you educated ladies. :)

I have many qualms about big government in general, but one of my biggest concerns about health care being provided through a federal government is this: we are beyond a shadow of a doubt the most overweight and probably most medicated of the "civilized" nations on this planet. All of us know many people who are on something for diabetes, heart disease, cholesterol, etc. No other country with socialized medicine has patients that eat as horribly as Americans do. Our life expectancy and quality of life is going down. Doctors preach preventative care, but how many patients actually listen and practice good eating habits/exercise? How many people would rather just go on drugs to help their problem rather than change what they are doing? We here at this forum are in the the vast minority.

To me it seems counterproductive to provide health care for all (or at least the option) yet not do anything about how food is manufactured, what chemicals are added, how much sugar/HFCS is being added to things (like baby food!). Wouldn't continuing to allow this stuff to be put on the shelves of our supermarkets and paying for the medicine/surgeries/therapies to correct it eventually bankrupt us? I am very interested to hear others thoughts on this. DH and I have been talking about this a lot, and while it "sounds" good to have health care whenever you need it, with our current health situations and how the government seems to feel about food and treatments to diseases anyways it seems... self defeating? Shouldn't the problem of food be fixed before we start thinking about paying everyone's medication and doctor's visits?

Missy
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Missy - I'm in total agreement with you that the food "industry" in this country has a big role in the proliferation of disease. The stuff that passes for actual "food" makes me sick...literally and figuratively. Food and health care go hand in hand, not doubt about it.

With regard to doctors preaching preventative care, one of the most interesting things noted in the Frontline episode that I linked was that in the UK system, doctors are given bonuses if they can improve chronic conditions, i.e. if a type 2 diabetic can get off the insulin, or someone can improve their cholesterol enough to not need meds, etc. What a concept!
 
Missy, I agree. I doubt the government will do much to clean-up food though. Agribusiness and Big Food are huge campaign contributors with strong lobbies.

DH and I watched The Future of Food last night. I find the whole thing depressing.
 
Well there is the conumdrum. You are not in favor of big govt but who else is going to crack down on the food industry? If we are reluctant to see govt involved in health care then how can be expect them to be involved in regulating food products. Can you just see the govt cracking down on HFCS and the lobbyists going insane and Rush complaining about big govt regulating business. I have never thought that unbridled capitalism is such a good thing but that is all you hear. That new book out by I think it is Kessler the former FDA administrator talks about the salt, sugar and fat contents of food that is deliberately put in to get you hooked. Even MacDonalds had psychologists working for them on how to get children hooked on their products. The reasoning was that if you get them young you will have them for life. I have to admit I am in favor of universal health care. I don't see how you can deprive people of health care because they have bad habits. Maybe going to a physician would help them to become more educated and clean up their act. I like the idea of providing doctors with incentives to help their patients become healthier. Profit driven health care seems immoral to me. Just an opinion.
 
PhyllisG said:
Well there is the conumdrum. You are not in favor of big govt but who else is going to crack down on the food industry?
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I don't think that I got this across well, but my point was that you can't pay to cover everyone's health costs but let what is causing their health problems go unchanged. I don't want a government that is bought by food companies, pharmaceutical companies, special interest groups in charge of my health care, in charge of my children's health care, my friends... the entire system is corrupt and owned by whoever has the big money. I really would be enthusiastic about a system where I really believed that the people were really what was cared about, that what was our best interest really was of priority, not the $$$.

Did you read Fast Food Nation by Eric Schlosser? It was very similar to what Kessler was saying. It is sickening to think about someone actually premeditatively getting you hooked on something that they know will eventually kill you... and that they can actually sleep at night, no problem. :mad: What makes them any better than drug dealer, besides the fact that it's legal?

Missy
 
Gayle said:
With regard to doctors preaching preventative care, one of the most interesting things noted in the Frontline episode that I linked was that in the UK system, doctors are given bonuses if they can improve chronic conditions, i.e. if a type 2 diabetic can get off the insulin, or someone can improve their cholesterol enough to not need meds, etc. What a concept!
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I am going to run off to watch the link now, but I think that the idea of rewards docs who are able to help their patients like that is fantastic!!!

Missy
 
Hey, I heard Hillary Clinton fractured her elbow yesterday. I bet she did it while she was bench pressing. :D
 
sparrow13 said:
I'm going to stay out of this debate for a change - anyone who's ever read anything I've posted on politics knows that I almost never think the answer to the "what will help?" question is "more government involvement" and that I think both parties are corrupt and repulsive but I did want to ask if anyone has noticed a subtle backlash against fitness and health in general? It seems like the trend these days is to talk up (dubious) studies that show exercise doesn't really make a difference/obesity isn't really a health problem etc.
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They just don't want obesity to become something that health insurance has to cover. What I mean by that is the treatment is not something they want to be covered. Also, having more people live a longer life means thats more people on Social Security for a longer time. They really just want us to pay into social security and then die right after we retire. GEt it?
 
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