So, who won the debate?

hortyhoos1 said:
Like I said..........if you're not against abortion, then you're in favor of abortion.
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It's not that black and white. It's entirely possible to dislike abortion but believe that other people should make that decision for themselves. I myself would not have one but if someone chooses to that is between them, their partner, and their god.

Sparrow
 
hortyhoos1 said:
Like I said..........if you're not against abortion, then you're in favor of abortion. The baby has no "choice." And, if you would vote in favor of same sex marriage, then you approve of it.
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It always makes me sad when people fail to try to understand what I and over half the country believe in. I know its easy simplify the situation to either you're for or against a woman's right to choose, but I don't think it is helpful or constructive to pigeonhole someone like that. It is, of course, your or anyone's right to choose an affirmative pro-life stance, as it is my own right to be pro-choice. I would never take that away from anyone nor would I belittle it.

However, it should be known to my disappointment that Senator Obama is not for gay marriage, though he does support civil unions:

"In an interview with the Chicago Daily Tribune, Obama said, "I'm a Christian. And so, although I try not to have my religious beliefs dominate or determine my political views on this issue, I do believe that tradition, and my religious beliefs say that marriage is something sanctified between a man and a woman."

Barack Obama did vote against a Federal Marriage Amendment and opposed the Defense of Marriage Act in 1996."​
 
sparrow13 said:
It's not that black and white. It's entirely possible to dislike abortion but believe that other people should make that decision for themselves. I myself would not have one but if someone chooses to that is between them, their partner, and their god.

Sparrow
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There-in lies the problem, their "god."
 
hottiescientist said:
It always makes me sad when people fail to try to understand what I and over half the country believe in. I know its easy simplify the situation to either you're for or against a woman's right to choose, but I don't think it is helpful or constructive to pigeonhole someone like that. It is, of course, your or anyone's right to choose an affirmative pro-life stance, as it is my own right to be pro-choice. I would never take that away from anyone nor would I belittle it.

However, it should be known to my disappointment that Senator Obama is not for gay marriage, though he does support civil unions:

"In an interview with the Chicago Daily Tribune, Obama said, "I'm a Christian. And so, although I try not to have my religious beliefs dominate or determine my political views on this issue, I do believe that tradition, and my religious beliefs say that marriage is something sanctified between a man and a woman."

Barack Obama did vote against a Federal Marriage Amendment and opposed the Defense of Marriage Act in 1996."​
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I'm just stating the facts as I've read them via CNN.
I'm not going to debate, I feel very strongly regarding this and that's the end of that.
 
hortyhoos1 said:
Like I said..........if you're not against abortion, then you're in favor of abortion. The baby has no "choice." And, if you would vote in favor of same sex marriage, then you're pro same sex marriage. God has been taken out of the equation on both issues and as a Christian, I will be voting my faith.
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Okay- I'm not even touching abortion...

BUT - I find the idea that "God" has been taken out of the equation on same sex marriages ridiculous and highly offensive. Have you ever actually known a gay person - man or woman. Seriously. Have you? Because if you have, you would know without a doubt that there is NO choice for them. That is the way they are. Period. They were born that way. Most of them at some point, at least before they have come to accept their reality, have wished to be anything other than what they are. In every animal species observed, there have been examples of gay animals - you cannot tell me that those animals choose to be gay. It's a natural thing. I find it very hard to believe that any God would create someone then abandon them just because they behaved in the way they were created to behave. And if he/she does, then that is not a god in which I wish to believe.

And the question I have to ask, is how does two men or two women getting married and enjoying the same benefits as the rest of us married folk, hurt YOU in any way?

*Steps off soap box*
 
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hortyhoos1 said:
I'm just stating the facts as I've read them via CNN.
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Sure, I can see how Obama's stance is more complicated that either just being for or against gay marriage. Here's the CNN's link to the candidates position of LGBT issues, but I've also copied and pasted what is published on the website:

Barack Obama
Opposes same-sex marriage, but also opposes a constitutional ban. Says he would repeal the Defense of Marriage Act and voted against the Federal Marriage Amendment. As stated on the Obama campaign Web site, he supports full civil unions that "give same-sex couples equal legal rights and privileges as married couples, including the right to assist their loved ones in times of emergency as well as equal health insurance, employment benefits, and property and adoption rights."

Says the Employment Non-Discrimination Act should be expanded to include sexual orientation and gender identity. Advocated legislation that sought to expand federal hate crimes law to include sexual orientation and gender identity.​
 
hortyhoos1 said:
Like I said..........if you're not against abortion, then you're in favor of abortion. The baby has no "choice." And, if you would vote in favor of same sex marriage, then you're pro same sex marriage. God has been taken out of the equation on both issues and as a Christian, I will be voting my faith.
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A comment I can agree with whole heartily!!! God needs to be put back in the equation!!
 
hortyhoos1 said:
But, as a Republican I definitely will not vote for Obama for his pro-abortion issues and pro same sex marriage.
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I don't think ANYONE is "Pro-abortion" :confused: : no one is encouraging people to get abortions, but "pro-choicers" think that women have the right to make their own choice, within certain guidelines.
 
diane57 said:
"I distrust you, I dislike you even though I don't really know you, I disapprove of you, I will ignore you, and if I cannot do that, I will come into your country and bomb the sh** out of you. There will be NO discourse, NO negotiating, NO sharing of viewpoints, NO search for common ground, NO respectful interaction. You are wrong and I am right. My way is God-Given and it's my way or the highway." And McCain pretty much confirmed that when he scoffed at the idea of ever using diplomacy to solve any problem. His arrogance, superiority, and barely concealed fury disgusted me.

I am SO glad I can vote for someone who is intelligent, kind, well-spoken and diplomatic.
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Well said.
 
hortyhoos1 said:
And, if you would vote in favor of same sex marriage, then you're pro same sex marriage.
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As someone already pointed out, Obama is not FOR same-sex marriage.

And how is God taken out of the equation when He made people the way they are?

(Sparrow and others: I think hortyhoos1 might be referring to the lack of capitalization of "god"? Indicating that the post was written by a non-believer? But I wouldn't want to speak for her...especially since we are far from on the same page. I just capitalized because I felt like it...sometimes I don't!)
 
If God had been in the "equation" Thomas Jefferson would have never been elected president...and he wouldn't be in this day and age. But, he was one of those community organizers, and we all know how worthless they are.
 
Whoo! Alright, never meant for this to turn in to a thread that supports proselytizing/preaching/"ominous words of warning on the state of your soul"...

Just wondered who you thought did better at the debate! Thanks for all your responses... I was kind of disappointed to see how many people didn't watch them, but I guess we're all a little burnt... next up, VP debates!! CanNOT wait for that! :)

I wish November would hurry up and get here!

MC
 
hortyhoos1 said:
I mean that the statement was... a person "and their god." (little "g") People have many different little gods, but there is only one true God. Everyone will know that one day.
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Wow! Whatever is right. Let's move onto the VP debates coming up.
 
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