So, who won the debate?

[baylian]

Yes! I love this.

Take a gander at this letter (directed at Dr. Laura Schlesinger, rabidly Christian, anti-gay talk show host), which outlines alot of OTHER things that the Bible says, since that's the position you're taking:


FYI - she is as Jewish as they come ~ not a Gentile.

 

[baylian]

So do you think McCain will lessen our tax burden? I think we are still going to pay a ridiculous amount of taxes like we do now, and still owe in April with either candidate.

Obama mentioned a plan to cut taxes for married couples making under 250,000K. Has McCain discussed his plans for taxes? I'm not being sarcastic, I actually don't know, I don't pay super close attention to all of this.

Why the need to penalize success? Just boggles the mind.

And I really don't care about a tax cut if the additional taxes on the "rich" are going to be used to fund social programs - i.e. - more people on the dole!!! And doing it just to get votes.

 

[hottiescientist]

Why are you so angry? I simply stated my thoughts on the the presidential debate, and I was bombarded by a flurry of jabs and insults. I don't need to defend my position in relation to God. I've been on both sides of the fence, and after much searching and reading of the Bible, I've found the only One who can redeem this broken life. He has my allegiance and my all. He tells us too that the Word is foolishness to those are are perishing. I choose to believe.

I don't think the previous poster was angry, but I know its hard to read emotion in text. You, of course, don't need to defend your position in relation to God. I don't think there were a lot of jabs and insults in your belief, but I think it came from you calling people who are pro-choice, pro-abortion. Perhaps you believe it comes to simply that woman's right to choose makes them pro-abortion, but you instead pressed on the point that they are pro-abortion when in fact, the official stance is pro-choice. Even if I were to think someone who opposed the right to choose is anti-choice, I would never call them anti-choice, but I would call it by the publicly accepted platform of pro-life. Just because I don't agree with someone of a different opinion, doesn't mean I can't respect them enough to call their platform by the phrase they choose to call themselves.

I think people who hear, "I couldn't vote for Obama because he's pro-choice and that doesn't coincide with my beliefs" can accept that much better than, "I couldn't vote for Obama because he's pro-abortion." But I will say that it does offend me when someone says I am pro-abortion instead of pro-choice.

 

[hiitdogs]

Since religion is a hot topic on this thread, I thought this was good information.

http://urbanlegends.about.com/library/bl_barack_obama_muslim.htm

<sigh> yeah, Obama is a muslim. Look at your own link, it says that claim is false

 

[hiitdogs]

Yes! I love this.

Take a gander at this letter (directed at Dr. Laura Schlesinger, rabidly Christian, anti-gay talk show host), which outlines alot of OTHER things that the Bible says, since that's the position you're taking:


FYI - she is as Jewish as they come ~ not a Gentile.

She renounced judaism in 2003.

 

[hottiescientist]

Why the need to penalize success? Just boggles the mind.

And I really don't care about a tax cut if the additional taxes on the "rich" are going to be used to fund social programs - i.e. - more people on the dole!!! And doing it just to get votes.

So, I'm hearing that you think that tax money shouldn't go to fund social programs -- and that's your opinion. But there was something that you said before that I wanted to some clarification. I think you mentioned something about getting taxed 40% of your taxes and how it has gotten worse. I do think its going to get worse given the current financial crisis for sure. But at least since 2000, there has been a reduction across all the tax brackets. In fact, it hasn't been as high 40% since the mid-80s. In fact, below are the US Tax Bracket*:

And you said your husband owns a business, I think? There should be several deductions you should be able to take to alleviate your tax burden to bring it effectively MUCH lower than than even 30% all within the letter of the law. If you really are paying so much, you should really switch your tax preparer and even review previous years' returns to see what money you could possibly get back. And if you do it by yourself, you may want to go to a professional group to review your returns because no one should be paying that high amount in the current system.

Text from Wikipedia:*An individual pays tax at a given bracket only for each dollar within that bracket's range. For example, a single taxpayer who earned $10,000 in 2007 would be taxed 10% of each dollar earned from the 1st dollar to the 7,825th dollar (10% × $7,825 = $782.50), then 15% of each dollar earned from the 7,826th dollar to the 10,000th dollar (15% × $2,175 = $326.25), for a total of $1,108.75. Notice this amount ($1,108.75) is lower than if the individual had been taxed at 15% on the full $10,000 (for a tax of $1,500). This is because the individual's marginal rate (the percentage tax on the last dollar earned, here 15%) has no effect on the income taxed at a lower bracket (here the first $7,825 of income taxed at 10%). This ensures that every rise in a person's pre-tax salary results in an increase of their after-tax salary.

 

[ksg68]

<sigh> yeah, Obama is a muslim. Look at your own link, it says that claim is false

<sigh> no where in my post did I say Obama was a muslim. I just said it was good information....

 

[hiitdogs]

<sigh> no where in my post did I say Obama was a muslim. I just said it was good information....

So why are you posting the question if Obama is a muslim? In the hopes that no one scrolls down to the bottom?

 

[baylian]

So, I'm hearing that you think that tax money shouldn't go to fund social programs -- and that's your opinion. But there was something that you said before that I wanted to some clarification. I think you mentioned something about getting taxed 40% of your taxes and how it has gotten worse. I do think its going to get worse given the current financial crisis for sure. But at least since 2000, there has been a reduction across all the tax brackets. In fact, it hasn't been as high 40% since the mid-80s. In fact, below are the US Tax Bracket*:

And you said your husband owns a business, I think? There should be several deductions you should be able to take to alleviate your tax burden to bring it effectively MUCH lower than than even 30% all within the letter of the law. If you really are paying so much, you should really switch your tax preparer and even review previous years' returns to see what money you could possibly get back. And if you do it by yourself, you may want to go to a professional group to review your returns because no one should be paying that high amount in the current system.

Text from Wikipedia:*An individual pays tax at a given bracket only for each dollar within that bracket's range. For example, a single taxpayer who earned $10,000 in 2007 would be taxed 10% of each dollar earned from the 1st dollar to the 7,825th dollar (10% × $7,825 = $782.50), then 15% of each dollar earned from the 7,826th dollar to the 10,000th dollar (15% × $2,175 = $326.25), for a total of $1,108.75. Notice this amount ($1,108.75) is lower than if the individual had been taxed at 15% on the full $10,000 (for a tax of $1,500). This is because the individual's marginal rate (the percentage tax on the last dollar earned, here 15%) has no effect on the income taxed at a lower bracket (here the first $7,825 of income taxed at 10%). This ensures that every rise in a person's pre-tax salary results in an increase of their after-tax salary.

My husband doesn't own the business - he is the corporate controller - an yes it may not be quite 40 % but its damn close. And he does our taxes along with our best man in our wedding who is a CPA and financial planner.

 

[hiitdogs]

My husband doesn't own the business - he is the corporate controller - an yes it may not be quite 40 % but its damn close. And he does our taxes along with our best man in our wedding who is a CPA and financial planner.

Wow, then your DH makes over $ 350,000 a year. Then I know where to go when I need a loan

 

[baylian]

She renounced judaism in 2003.

I stand corrected - I did not know this.

In July 2003, Schlessinger announced on her show that she was no longer an Orthodox Jew. In a series of monologues over the next month, she explained that she did not feel a connection with God, and felt frustrated by the effort she had put into following the religion. Her religious approach on the show lessened substantially after this announcement. She emphasized on the air how her Christian callers always reached out to her as a respected and valued friend, unlike her Jewish contacts, who were inclined to be indifferent.

 

[baylian]

Wow, then your DH makes over $ 350,000 a year. Then I know where to go when I need a loan

Where the hang did you get that idea? NOT . . remember he is in lumber and no one is building right now.

 

[kathryn]

Getting back to the debate , I finally watched it.

I thought it was kind of strange that the moderator kept trying to get the two to talk to each other, like he was trying to get them to fight. Is that typical of presidential debates? I haven't watched that much of any.

They started out a bit rocky, I thought (and rambling), but got better from there.

 

[hiitdogs]

Where the hang did you get that idea? NOT . . remember he is in lumber and no one is building right now.

Okay, Baylian, I was joking - you know those Germans - shouldn't try at humor, they just don't have it, even if they try hard I was looking at the table that hottiescientist posted and I was trying to lighten things up.

 

[SirenSongWoman]

I just want to add it is not pro abortion--it is pro choice. No one is for abortion--but the majority are for a woman's right to choose with her own conscience, doctor and family.
Also I don't think Obama is pro same sex marriage but does support civil unions which means a same sex couple can have the same rights as family legally--hospital visits, rental leases and health care coverage etc.

Diane i agree with you and well said.

I'm an Obama supporter because he believes in including EVERYONE. Sorry to those who have a problem with gay people. A lot of my friends are gay and have been with me through thick-and-thin so I love a candidate who includes my friends because he's not afraid of them. People who are hostile towards gay people are missing out on some of the best friends they'll ever have. What a shame.

Growing up, I was always pro-choice because I believe other people's reproductive decisions are their own, and that hasn't changed. Still, pro or con, I can't believe anyone would make abortion their litmus test for a presidential candidate at a time like this. I mean, how common IS abortion anymore, really? I have no clue what the statistics are but I'm betting of all the pregnancies that occur in the United States, less than half a single percent end in abortion. Maybe abortion USED to be an issue but, really, I'm thinking most women use birth control. In my neighborhood, I'm SURROUNDED by women who have one baby after another and who seem to never have heard of abortion (or birth control!). So I truly feel that if you're deciding who to vote for based on an issue that, in the face of the fact that our nation is well on it's way to being no more, you REALLY need to WAKE THE **** UP and start getting concerned about REAL issues that effect EVERYONE. Please?

 

[SirenSongWoman]

My guess is Palin's going to need big Gods AND little gods to get through them in one piece.

Sparrow

Too funny!

 

[SirenSongWoman]

Okay, Baylian, I was joking - you know those Germans - shouldn't try at humor, they just don't have it, even if they try hard I was looking at the table that hottiescientist posted and I was trying to lighten things up.

Wait a minute, Carola. I'm German and I AM FUNNY!!! Hysterical, even

 

[baylian]

Okay, Baylian, I was joking - you know those Germans - shouldn't try at humor, they just don't have it, even if they try hard I was looking at the table that hottiescientist posted and I was trying to lighten things up.

Sorry - I can claim only a quarter German in my blood - hence the slow uptake on the joke.

 

[baylian]

Wait a minute, Carola. I'm German and I AM FUNNY!!! Hysterical, even

tehehehehehehehehe

 

[hottiescientist]

I mean, how common IS abortion anymore, really? I have no clue what the statistics are but I'm betting of all the pregnancies that occur in the United States, less than half a single percent end in abortion. Maybe abortion USED to be an issue but, really, I'm thinking most women use birth control. In my neighborhood, I'm SURROUNDED by women who have one baby after another and who seem to never have heard of abortion (or birth control!).

Sorry if I seem annoying by constantly citing and linking stuff, but I find it a lot easier to digest information when I see tables and figures than someone picking a random number that seems outrageous and then its more about exaggeration. I'm not mad by it or even surprised but it never helps me form my opinion so I always look stuff up.

Anyway, there is an inherent problem with abortion rates because it is not mandatory to report AND you don't know how many are for medial reasons or rape or incest. We have basic ideas for sure but how exact or reliable is an issue. But for sure, there is a decrease from a couple decades ago which some people attribute to better knowledge and more accessible birth control (CDC data):

So, in the US, unfortunately abortions are higher than "half a single percent." Being pro-choice though, I look at that data and I go, we need to do more to keep that rate going down.