So, who won the debate?

I don't know, technically on jabs exchanged it may be a draw or even advantage McCain. Overall on style and substance I think Obama won hands down.

McCain's whole demeanour was hostile, condenscending, he had that smirk on his face that really aggrevated me. He didn't even look at Obama or acknowledge him. And that's the guy who claims he can work on a bipartisan basis and bring people together. I think not!!!

I thought Obama did much better, he pointed out where he differed or disagreed but on occassion said he agreed with McCain. I know the RNC and McCain campaign is drooling and jumping all over Obama saying he agreed with McCain but to me Obama is the real consensus builder. He was calm, collected, had a real grasp on issues but was tough nevertheless. That's the guy I would like to have in power and at the negotiating table in sticky situations.

McCain bored me to tears with his hitting on earmarks and pork-barrel spending over and over again. Earmarks are not the reason why our economy is in so much trouble and cutting the earmark spending will not get the economy back on track. I agree it needs to be addressed but on my day planner I wouldn't give it a A1 priority.
We are spending $ 10 Bio/month in Iraq, a war that McCain wants to continue indefinitely and laments over earmarks that are a fraction of what we are spending in Iraq. Not to mention lives lost.

I was glad that Obama finally hit McCain on McCain's "joke" about singing Bombbombbomb Iran. Someone who jokes about going to war with another country and the enormous tragedy a war brings in lives lost, should not be in charge of making decisions about war and peace.
 
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I'm a die hard democrat too, and though there's pretty much nothing I agree with McCain about out policy, I thought as a debate McCain won narrowly. I do agree that Obama seemed more "presidential" but I think that may be a reflection on what we want to see in a President. There are some people who do not think that kind of demeanor, especially contrasted with McCain's, is the right kind of "strength" to exude. In fact, this has been one of the negatives against Obama (his demeanor) though its one of the reasons to why I'm attracted to him.

But I will say that I was disappointed in Obama's inability to answer to the point. I think this will improve, and as it improves, more people will flock to him, but he does need to work on saying "umm" a lot less and answering the question in less than 50 words.

So, from an academic sense of grading a debate, McCain barely won. But personally, didn't care for his grumpy behavior, his policies, or repetition. I think people on the left probably felt good about their candidate, people on the right felt good about their candidate, and independents didn't real feel any different from before. My two cents.
 
I taped them and didn't watch yet, but I did 'sneak over' during commerical breaks from another show and saw some of it.

As others, I wouldn't be swayed by McCain no matter what, but I thought he was condescending ("Obama doesn't understand" said in a tone that suggested that Obama is too young and naïve to know what is going on).

He also never looked at Obama when Obama was speaking (as Obama did with him), which I found to be rude. It makes me wonder how he deals with foreign dignitaries or others that he may not like or with whom he may disagree.

One thing I found interesting is that during the after-debate commentary, Biden commented for the Democrats, but Palin had refused the invitation and Gulini gave the Republican perspective instead. (What's with her inaccessibility? I'm imagining spin doctors and PR people keeping Palin holed-up in a secret room where they are drilling her on what to say, how to say it, what not to say, before she's 'allowed' to talk to the press).
 
hiitdogs said:
Obama is the real consensus builder. He was calm, collected, had a real grasp on issues but was tough nevertheless. That's the guy I would like to have in power and at the negotiating table in sticky situations.
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Absolutely.
I think he would be able to make more allies and deal with other countries respectfully but firmly, rather than with the hostility that McCain shows.
 
hottiescientist said:
I do agree that Obama seemed more "presidential" but I think that may be a reflection on what we want to see in a President. There are some people who do not think that kind of demeanor, especially contrasted with McCain's, is the right kind of "strength" to exude. In fact, this has been one of the negatives against Obama (his demeanor) though its one of the reasons to why I'm attracted to him.
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Unfortunately, I do think there are people who don't want a president who seems too intellectual. They prefer the old 'cowboy' mentality often shown by the Republican leaders.
 
kathryn said:
One thing I found interesting is that during the after-debate commentary, Biden commented for the Democrats, but Palin had refused the invitation and Gulini gave the Republican perspective instead. (What's with her inaccessibility? I'm imagining spin doctors and PR people keeping Palin holed-up in a secret room where they are drilling her on what to say, how to say it, what not to say, before she's 'allowed' to talk to the press).
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Kathryn, haven't you seen the Katie Couric interview with Sarah Palin?

I bet you anything the McCain campaign is still trying to figure out how they can cancel the VP debate after the Katie Couric debacle. IMO the whole McCain thing about postponing the presidential debate was about cancelling the VP debate.
 
hottiescientist said:
But I will say that I was disappointed in Obama's inability to answer to the point. I think this will improve, and as it improves, more people will flock to him, but he does need to work on saying "umm" a lot less and answering the question in less than 50 words.
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Before the debate, experts were saying that Obama's weakness in the debate could be talking too much, while McCain's weakness would be having a "senior moment." (Not having watched, I didn't see if there were any "senior moments" beyond his "grumpy old man" demeanor at times).
 
Our news is saying that the concensus is that Obama won hands down. I would agree with that. Obama came across as being Presidential. McCain as a bitter old man. Although, I'm another one who wouldn't vote for McCain if McCain was the only candidate.

As for Palin - I've been reading news articles from conservation Republicans asking that she gracefully step aside and let McCain select another VP Candidate. Her interviews were horrid, and she comes across as not having a grasp on what she is expected to do. Sorry, but we do NOT need a hockey mom in the White House. We need someone who knows what he/she is doing. To quote Kathleen Parker, a conservative Republican and early supporter of Palin, "It was fun while it lasted," Parker writes. "Palin’s recent interviews with Charles Gibson, Sean Hannity, and now Katie Couric have all revealed an attractive, earnest, confident candidate. Who is clearly out of her league." (quoted from this article - http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.co...ould-step-down-conservative-commentator-says/_)
 
andtckrtoo said:
Sorry, but we do NOT need a hockey mom in the White House. We need someone who knows what he/she is doing.
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I agree with you, Christine. But it seems as half of the country is looking for someone they can "identify with".

I really would want someone who is smarter than most of us because he or she is leading one of the most powerful nations in the world. I would hope that this time around people have learned their lesson from the last 8 year debacle.
 
Hmm, . . .I'm a republican but quite frankly neither party floats my boat. I watched a bit of it and I sorta thought that they were arguing like 2 high school teenage girls.
 
I'm not sold on either candidate. But, as a Republican I definitely will not vote for Obama for his pro-abortion issues and pro same sex marriage. So, I find myself having to vote for McCain simply because I do not want Obama running the country. Sad, but true.
 
I am the complete opposit of hortyhoos1 on social issues - I am vehemently pro-choice and pro-gay rights and those issues are almost more important to me than any others, so I could never vote for a Republican in the party's current incarnation of social ultra-conservatism. I did vote for Reagan and I am still proud to have done so. The Republican party has morphed into something unrecognizable since that time.

But apart from that, I though McCains' condecending behavior was rude and appalling. That to me is a "Republican" style of interaction: "I distrust you, I dislike you even though I don't really know you, I disapprove of you, I will ignore you, and if I cannot do that, I will come into your country and bomb the sh** out of you. There will be NO discourse, NO negotiating, NO sharing of viewpoints, NO search for common ground, NO respectful interaction. You are wrong and I am right. My way is God-Given and it's my way or the highway." And McCain pretty much confirmed that when he scoffed at the idea of ever using diplomacy to solve any problem. His arrogance, superiority, and barely concealed fury disgusted me. I am SO glad I can vote for someone who is intelligent, kind, well-spoken and diplomatic.
 
diane57 said:
I am the complete opposit of hortyhoos1 on social issues - I am vehemently pro-choice and pro-gay rights and those issues are almost more important to me than any others, so I could never vote for a Republican in the party's current incarnation of social ultra-conservatism. I did vote for Reagan and I am still proud to have done so. The Republican party has morphed into something unrecognizable since that time.

But apart from that, I though McCains' condecending behavior was rude and appalling. That to me is a "Republican" style of interaction: "I distrust you, I dislike you even though I don't really know you, I disapprove of you, I will ignore you, and if I cannot do that, I will come into your country and bomb the sh** out of you. There will be NO discourse, NO negotiating, NO sharing of viewpoints, NO search for common ground, NO respectful interaction. You are wrong and I am right. My way is God-Given and it's my way or the highway." And McCain pretty much confirmed that when he scoffed at the idea of ever using diplomacy to solve any problem. His arrogance, superiority, and barely concealed fury disgusted me. I am SO glad I can vote for someone who is intelligent, kind, well-spoken and diplomatic.
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Bravo Diane...I enjoyed reading your post and completely agree with you ;)
 
hortyhoos1 said:
I'm not sold on either candidate. But, as a Republican I definitely will not vote for Obama for his pro-abortion issues and pro same sex marriage. So, I find myself having to vote for McCain simply because I do not want Obama running the country. Sad, but true.
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I just want to add it is not pro abortion--it is pro choice. No one is for abortion--but the majority are for a woman's right to choose with her own conscience, doctor and family.
Also I don't think Obama is pro same sex marriage but does support civil unions which means a same sex couple can have the same rights as family legally--hospital visits, rental leases and health care coverage etc.

Diane i agree with you and well said.
 
diane57 said:
The Republican party has morphed into something unrecognizable since that time.
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Amen.

diane57 said:
But apart from that, I though McCains' condecending behavior was rude and appalling. That to me is a "Republican" style of interaction: "I distrust you, I dislike you even though I don't really know you, I disapprove of you, I will ignore you, and if I cannot do that, I will come into your country and bomb the sh** out of you. There will be NO discourse, NO negotiating, NO sharing of viewpoints, NO search for common ground, NO respectful interaction. You are wrong and I am right. My way is God-Given and it's my way or the highway."
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Well, Democrats have their share of rude and appalling moments. Obama was certainly calm and polite but I would chalk that up to his sensibility and upbringing, not his political party.

Also, I feel the need to point out that what we have witnessed in the last eight years is not true Republicanism or Conservatism. These are Neo-cons and members of the Religious Right.

Many true Conservatives, such as myself, have fled to the Libertarians, with good reason. :D

Sparrow
 
I'm Republican - did vote for Clinton the second time around just because at the time I was a union person. I live in Michigan and the unions have all but desecrated this state. It's sad because at one time I feel they served a good purpose but not anymore . . I got tired of seeing people protected from their bad job performance just because they paid union dues. And no I wasn't in the auto industry - airlines.

Also - I get darn tired of getting behind these people (mostly women) who have kids out of wedlock that they cannot support, paying with food stamps, not working and have the bling going, cell phones, nails done and buying really crappy food to feed the children and this scene will only increase with Obama in office. The social programs will go through the roof. And I for one am tired of watching 40% of my DH's hard earned money go to support these people.

I feel the debate was pretty much a yawner and a draw. Neither had the collective knock down. And for all that say "he sounded like a president" - there is a big diff between sounding and being. I guess if I had to say that there was one moment that caught my ear and that was McCain's come back on sitting down with the president of Iraq. I agree we need to protect Israel's interest and not legitimize these rogue nations. Someone wrote earlier that shifting the war to Afghanistan will in reality prolong our presence there so to speak and they are right. I'm sorry - can't remember who wrote that.

The economy - both sides to blame. No crap about that. My husband is in the whole sale lumber business and he said to hold on to my a$$ as this winter will be worse than last. And last year was bad. But we have budgeted pretty well and have faith in the good Lord that he will see us through. We blame no one. I took on a part time job for a while to help out. Now with a sick father in Florida my little help job is on hold. I have realized there are more important things in life. I used to cruise the make up aisles at the major department stores - now I am just as happy cruising the Walgreens store. As long as I have my Cathe work outs, roof over my head (that needs some repairs), a healthy family, great school for my son and enough money to have my hair professionally colored every two months - I am content.

This too shall pass . . . . .
 
baylian said:
I guess if I had to say that there was one moment that caught my ear and that was McCain's come back on sitting down with the president of Iraq. I agree we need to protect Israel's interest and not legitimize these rogue nations.
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I'm sure it was a typo, but you mean Iran.
 
PhyllisG said:
I just want to add it is not pro abortion--it is pro choice. No one is for abortion--but the majority are for a woman's right to choose with her own conscience, doctor and family.
Also I don't think Obama is pro same sex marriage but does support civil unions which means a same sex couple can have the same rights as family legally--hospital visits, rental leases and health care coverage etc.

Diane i agree with you and well said.
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Like I said..........if you're not against abortion, then you're in favor of abortion. The baby has no "choice." And, if you would vote in favor of same sex marriage, then you're pro same sex marriage. God has been taken out of the equation on both issues and as a Christian, I will be voting my faith.
 
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Thank you

hottiescientist for the correction - yes, I meant Iran. Sorry - watching college football at the same time as typing and have a tendency to stop and yell at tv.
 
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