Something I've been wondering about....

Fit_mommy

Fit_mommy

Cathlete
From a clean eating stand point...what is so wrong with dairy products? Which is better-being able to eat more of the low fat versions or eating less of the full fat?

I currently use skim milk but tend to use mostly regular cheeses. I will buy a really l/f or f/f cheese on occasion but it's like cardboard so I don't see the point! x(

I ask this because I LOOOOVE dairy...I thrive on cheese and milk. I eat TONS of cereal and would go broke if I had to buy soy milk for it every week. I also eat turkey sandwiches often and love cheese on them!:9 :9 :9

ETA: I also make my protein shakes with skim milk...making them with water is just too nasty!! BLECH!x(

TIA!:+
 
Well, from my own low carb diet perspective most dairy is really high carb (fortunately I find milk & yogurt totally gross so it hasn't been an issue for me). And the good news for low carb dieters is that cheese is zero carbs. I'm not sure why milk is so high carb & cheese is zero carb--obviously something in the processing but I have no idea what--but it's great for me b/c I love cheese on pretty much everything. :9
 
I'm following you around this afternoon ;)

Personally, I think it's better to eat the "regular" stuff in addition to the foods that are just naturally lower in sugar and fat (ie cottage cheese & berries, tuna, etc).

I stay away from the products that claim "fat free" or "sugar free" just b/c they are loaded with other stuff and often taste fake. Yuck-o.

I'm with you on the cheese thing. I love a slice on my sammich, but that's all I have. Or, if I'm making an egg white omelet, I add a touch of shredded parm or some other cheese. Doing this way, which is perfect moderation to me, seems just fine.

Now I can't answer you about the soy milk. I haven't tried it. I do the skim milk as well. Nothing wrong with the skim. Some people just prefer the soy milk, some have dairy issues, etc.

Does that help some?


Debbie


Peter: Oh my god, Brian, there's a message in my Alphabits. It says, 'Oooooo.'
Brian: Peter, those are Cheerios.
--Family Guy
 
I definitely can't give up my dairy, but I do like soymilk too. My dd is allergic, so I buy her soy & almond milk, which is really good too!

I love cheese, my favorite reduced fat is Cabot's 50% light cheddar. REALLY good for a lower fat cheddar. Otherwise I just stick to mozzarella or reduced fat or fat free feta. I will not eat the fat free regular cheese though, blech!!

I've read that milk products really make people bloat & there are a lot of people w/ milk allergies. I won't give up my cottage cheese & yogurt either! ;-)
 
I'm with you...I LOVE cheese, and the lowfat stuff is awful. I have tried Cabot's and Cracker Barrel. Out of those two low fat cheeses, Cracker Barrel is my favorite. If there were a shortage of cheese, I'd go crazy!
And, like you, I am iced in with my little guy too. We ran out of cheddar cheese lastnight, so I had to settle for American today. I read your post about non-stop snacking. I made the beer bread from Tastefully Simple lastnight, and between my DH and me, the whole thing is almost gone:eek: .
-Jen
p.s. Did I work out? NO!
 
I'm with ya on this one ~I love dairy and have been wondering about this also...Will give this a bump so maybe someone in-the-know can shed some light. Thanks for posting it!

Cathy :)
 
About cheese being zero carb. Yes, it must be due to the curds and whey. I forget which one is strained and thrown out. Time to break out the Little House on the Praire books. LOL

I'm lactose intolerant. Milk and ice cream reeks havoc on my digestive system. Half the time I can't remember where I placed my pills, so I don't even bother. My dairy usually comes from yogurt, cheese and cream in my coffee.

As for the rest of my family, I buy raw milk from a local dairy farmer for $2.00 a gallon. Yes, I know there's a lot of controversy on raw vs. processed that I'd won't involve myself with. My girls can't stand the taste of processed milk. Personally, I don't taste the difference. Then again, I don't regularly drink milk. Sometimes, I'll skim off the top and use it for butter or creamer. Another lady I know buys about 10 gallons a week and makes her own cheese and yogurt. The dairy farmer and I laughingly agree that it's too Little House on the Praire for us!
 
I think for those who don't eat/drink animal products this is a problem. As far as clean eating, dairy is fine. I do the skim thing and also buy my milk from cows not treated with growth hormones.
 
Thanks for all of your input ladies. I feel better about my dairy intake now. I almost forgot to mention my love affair with cottage cheese as well! I am a dairy queen and would HATE to hear that it's bad for me! :eek:
 
Dairy, and cheese especially, is the biggest contributor of saturated fats in most American diets.

Dairy has a very acidifying effect on the body. And an acid environment promotes disease.

Dairy consumption has been linked to prostate and reproductive cancers as welll as other diseases.

Eliminating dairy from the diet can relieve allergy and asthma.

Low fat dairy has even higher protein than regular milk, which can lead to leaching of alkaline minerals from the body: there is a direction corrolation between amount of dairy consumed and rates of osteoporosis (countries with the highest dairy consumption also have the highest rates of osteoporosis. The calcium in dairy can't make up for the acidifying effects and calcium leaching.)

The US allows higher levels of pus (yes, PUS) in milk than any other country. When producers started using BGH (Bovine Growth Hormone), incidences of mastitis in cows increased, and the level of pus increased as well. Instead of prohibiting the sale of this milk, the FDA (or USDA, I forget which) raised the allowable levels.

Milk contains the hormones and antibiotics given to the animal.

Cow's milk, or any other animal's milk, is not a natural food for humans (most of whom lose their ability to digest lactose around the age of 2, when human babies would by naturally weened off their mother's milk), and not even adult cows drink it after weening.

Perhaps one reason people say they 'can't give up' dairy is because they are addicted. Dairy contains substances called caseinomorphins, which (as the name suggests) act somewhat like morphine.

(On another note: anyone who opposes the cruelty of veal 'production' should avoid dairy, because there is no dairy without calves, many of whom--'useless' males especially---are sold as veal calves.)
 
Acid is not necessarily bad for the body. Exercise induces lactic acidosis (definately at the usual level of Catheite) and it is good for us!

I am wondering your source for saying that dairy is linked to prostate and reproductive cancers, allergies, and asthma. In the case of prostate and reproductive cancers, they are linked to obesity, but according to Robbins Pathology (the god of Pathology), not dairy.

Also, you can get milk without calves. Even in humans, tactile stimulation (if long enough) can cause lactation in women (and men for that matter). That is how wet nurses supply milk. :)

-Becky
2nd year med student
 
> That is how wet nurses
>supply milk. :)
>

Wet nurses, at least traditional ones, were women who had recently given birth themselves. Cows need to be reimpregnated about every 2 years to keep the milk flowing.

I'll get back to you about the prostate cancer links, etc. Most of it is cited in "The China Study" or by John Robbins, both of which give references for the studies that they cite.


Yes, exercise does produce lactic acid, which the body has to buffer some way. I one eats a high-alkaline diet, exercise recovery is better (one source: Brendan Brazier, Canadian triathlete and ultramarathoner, "Thrive").
 
Becky:

Here are a few links about dairy and its links to disease (I don't have time to look through my library of books, but this will give you some info. Note: these are not the sources I got my information, which were books citing studies, and Í haven't read all of the articles):

Dairy and prostate cancer risk increase:
http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/abstract/74/4/549
http://www.pcrm.org/health/Dairy_and_Prostate_Cancer/d_p_article.html
http://www.milksucks.com/prostate.asp

Links between reproductive cancers and dairy are primarily due to the hormones (both natural and added) in milk and exposure to chemicals in milk:
http://www.news.harvard.edu/gazette/2006/12.07/11-dairy.htmlhttp://www.wgenblaw.com/human.pdf
http://www.diagnose-me.com/cond/C393716.html

I personally know people who have had allergy symptoms reduced after eliminating dairy from their diets (including my own allergies to cats and nature in general, and a roommate who was severaly allergic to her brother's cat until she gave up dairy)and Dr. Neal Barnard and Dr. Joel Fuhrman both write about links between respiratory problems and dairy consumption. Unfortunately, I'm finding it hard to do a search for "dairy and allergies" without getting just information on "allergies to dairy", but here's some info on asthma and dairy (the link between the two is debated):
http://www.newstarget.com/010443.html
http://www.milksucks.com/mucus.asp (not my favorite source, but look at the people and organizations they cite)
http://www.notmilk.com/deb/asthma.html
http://www.earthclinic.com/CURES/asthma.html
There is also info at Dr. Joel Fuhrman's site, but you have to be a member to get access to the newsletter, and it's impossible to cut-and-paste it.

HTH
 
Actually, just the heavy breathing one does following exercise takes away the acid. CO2 is acidic...you are breathing it off. Be careful about trying to alkalinize yourself too much. An alkaline pH is MUCH more harmful than an acidic pH. Also, it is also much better to trust your doctor than a celebrity/athlete who writes a book.

Do you know if these studies were published in a peer-reviewed scientific journal? Also, what kind of experiments were conducted? Randomized controlled trials, as well as meta-analysis of RCTs are the best. One study here and there are not reputable.

But then, I am a very scientific future MD, so unless it has been studied to death, I am skeptical (which is good, because I won't kill patients due to faulty evidence). After my national boards, I'll have more time to look into issues like these. Today however, my goofing off is over and I must get back to the reproductive tract. :)

-Becky
 
For anyone interested- I make soy milk using the Soy-a-Joy - you can order it on the internet. Once you've bought it, you can make as much soy milk as you want very easily for about $.43 a gallon.

I love cheese, but I try to keep dairy to a minimum. I've read studies that show that statistically you can gain all of the health benefits of staying non-dairy by keeping your consumption of dairy (and other animal based products) to less than 10% of your calorie consumption per day.

So I choose only my favorite most flavorful cheese and have just a bit. I find soy milke and Earth Balance soy/olive/canola margarine to be suitable substitutes for cow's milk and butter.

Hope that helps.
Cheryl
 
Some women are so sensitive that just their bra brushing up against their nipples on a daily basis causes them to start to lactate. I am sure some wet nurses were new mothers, but really, you don't need to give birth to lactate. Those that were in high demand were easy lactaters.
 
>Just one word Kathryn...Hogwash!
>
>Susan


I LOVE how people are dismissive with NO evidence! Have you read her citations? Have you read ANY study regarding the consumption of dairy and the effects on the body?
Didn't think so...

Carolyn


Oh, and just one word....DENIAL!:)
 
>
>But then, I am a very scientific future MD, so unless it has
>been studied to death, I am skeptical (which is good, because
>I won't kill patients due to faulty evidence). After my
>national boards, I'll have more time to look into issues like
>these. Today however, my goofing off is over and I must get
>back to the reproductive tract. :)
>
>-Becky


Hi Becky, I was wondering if you've heard of dairy making the body more acidic and essentially stripping the body of calcium? The China Study compared the lifestyles of rural Chinese people (who eat very little dairy), and those of Western people (who eat TONS of dairy), and found the hip fracture rate of the Western people to be MUCH MUCH higher. I'm not sure why (don't have the book in front of me), but it seemed like a pretty good/well done nutritional study on a large scale, which has never been done before. I'm not trying to be argumentative (with you ;-) ), just wondering if you've heard of this. I may contribute more to this thread later (but maybe not, as I tire of people throwing insults at the vegans on this forum, not that you would do that;-) )

Carolyn
 
Not to be rude but I don't know that some of these links would be considered quality sources for such information given their clear bias. If you really want to research one might want to take a gander at peer reviewed articles and academic sources. Not milksucks.com
BTW, soy sucks :7 :7
 
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