CATHE vs P90X
- Thread starter Stacy
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kathryn
Cathlete
I'd say:
Intensity: P90X strength training is more intense than Cathe. Cathe cardio is more intense than P90X (though Plyo X is pretty intense). The lower intensity of the cardio in P90X DOES fit well with the goal of building muscle and not breaking it down. In the context of the entire rotation, it feels just perfect. (In general, the P90X rotation is wonderfully planned, with a good balance of strength, cardio, plyometrics, yoga and stretching, including really good stretches in each of the workouts).
Fun factor: I'm sure most people on this would find Cathe cardio more fun than P90X cardio because it's dancier and has more music (the music in P90X is pretty nondiscript, IMO, which I actually like because it doesn't run around in my head all day). I think the P90X strength workouts are, maybe not more fun, but more interesting, because of the way they are set up (either push/pull or a cycle where you do one exercise for the chest, then shoulders , then triceps, then repeat the series , take a short stretch break, and go on to another cycle (instead of working all chest until done, then going on to sholders, etc.) The workouts go buy really fast, though I never feel rushed (like I do in PUB/PLB, which is otherwise one of my favorite Cathe workouts) and there are some exercises in them I'd never seen in a video before (including more than 6 variations on the simple bicep curl)
Which is more intense? (Haven't I seen this before?;-) ) Cathe is more intense cardio-wise, P90X is more intense strength wise.
I have over 200 workout videos (I don't dare count!), and those are only the ones I've kept (I've sold or donated many more than that over the years), and I've got to say that P90X is the best exercise DVD investment I've ever made!
I'm hoping that Cathe's new series will make it difficult for me to choose whether I prefer P90X or Cathe!
Intensity: P90X strength training is more intense than Cathe. Cathe cardio is more intense than P90X (though Plyo X is pretty intense). The lower intensity of the cardio in P90X DOES fit well with the goal of building muscle and not breaking it down. In the context of the entire rotation, it feels just perfect. (In general, the P90X rotation is wonderfully planned, with a good balance of strength, cardio, plyometrics, yoga and stretching, including really good stretches in each of the workouts).
Fun factor: I'm sure most people on this would find Cathe cardio more fun than P90X cardio because it's dancier and has more music (the music in P90X is pretty nondiscript, IMO, which I actually like because it doesn't run around in my head all day). I think the P90X strength workouts are, maybe not more fun, but more interesting, because of the way they are set up (either push/pull or a cycle where you do one exercise for the chest, then shoulders , then triceps, then repeat the series , take a short stretch break, and go on to another cycle (instead of working all chest until done, then going on to sholders, etc.) The workouts go buy really fast, though I never feel rushed (like I do in PUB/PLB, which is otherwise one of my favorite Cathe workouts) and there are some exercises in them I'd never seen in a video before (including more than 6 variations on the simple bicep curl)
Which is more intense? (Haven't I seen this before?;-) ) Cathe is more intense cardio-wise, P90X is more intense strength wise.
I have over 200 workout videos (I don't dare count!), and those are only the ones I've kept (I've sold or donated many more than that over the years), and I've got to say that P90X is the best exercise DVD investment I've ever made!
I'm hoping that Cathe's new series will make it difficult for me to choose whether I prefer P90X or Cathe!
Okay, as a new user of p90x (received a month ago, and used off and on, but just now started and "official" rotation) I will give my honest opinion. I think the strength workout in p90x is so much more intense and less monotonous. I find the shoulders and arm workout to fly by because there are new moves as opposed to the same old bicep curls etc...This can be an endurance or strength workout depending on your own personal preference. I really feel "pumped up" after doing a p90x strength workout, and believe it or not, after just a few, i can see some difference in my arms.
I love cathe's strength workouts, but always felt they were more "endurance" geared, and not enough variety.
As far as cardio goes, I just love my Cathe interval work and kickboxing. I was a bit disappointed with the p90x cardio x (not plyo x, i LOVE that), and also with kenpo x, but i'll sub in cathe's KPC and probably another cardio for those.
Right now i like ab ripper x, but as a variety junkie, i'm sure i'll be doing cardio hits real soon at least once a week.
i don't know if that helps or not, but all i can offer up as an opinion is to get both }( }(
I love cathe's strength workouts, but always felt they were more "endurance" geared, and not enough variety.
As far as cardio goes, I just love my Cathe interval work and kickboxing. I was a bit disappointed with the p90x cardio x (not plyo x, i LOVE that), and also with kenpo x, but i'll sub in cathe's KPC and probably another cardio for those.
Right now i like ab ripper x, but as a variety junkie, i'm sure i'll be doing cardio hits real soon at least once a week.
i don't know if that helps or not, but all i can offer up as an opinion is to get both }( }(
spiderwomen118
Cathlete
I have to say it's not really a question of Cathe vs P90X its more like Cathe or P90X. If you want to focus on some real intense strength training for a while, I would suggest P90X. Except for the legs I do add a Cathe tape, I like a little more work for my legs, and as far as cardio I could see adding a Cathe tape but other than that I would definitely say P90X has the strength portion down. You can vary your strength as someone else has already mentioned, you can make it more endurance based or more muscle building based. More reps versus fewer reps. I don't think you'll be dissatisfied with the DVD's, there is a lot of variety, I think their both very compatible with each other.
I have to say that I find P90X cardio very refreshing and that's mainly because I'm not a cardio fan. So to me the moves are interesting and less monotonous and boring that a typical step workout. I hate step. *S*
On the other hand, KPC is a big favorite.
I think there's a place for both Cathe and P90X to live happily together, having the variety is the key for me.
On the other hand, KPC is a big favorite.
I think there's a place for both Cathe and P90X to live happily together, having the variety is the key for me.
How much is the pull-up bar used? I'm pretty weak in that area and can barely do one pull-up (I tried it on my nephew's swing set, lol). A pull-up bar just won't work in my workout area.
What are some modifications and are they effective? If I leave out the pull-ups would I be omitting alot of the P90X program??
This is my one last deciding factor before I purchase!
What are some modifications and are they effective? If I leave out the pull-ups would I be omitting alot of the P90X program??
This is my one last deciding factor before I purchase!
Stacy, I don't do pull-ups/chin-ups at all because I don't have room for a tower and the Door Gym isn't convenient for me (no doorways in my workout area)...I've been using resistance bands to do pull-downs during those sets--I have the band looped around my stair railing spindle at the highest point. Kathryn (forgive me for speaking for you) has done heavy one-arm rows as a substitution as well. I don't believe a pull-down works in quite the same way a pull-up would, but I don't believe you'd lose anything by it...I can feel my back/lats/arms working plenty during every pull-down.
They do show modifications using bands. I don't have a pull up bar and I still get a really good workout. I love both my cathe's and P90X because they are so different from each other. P90X is like doing sprints and then stopping and shaking it out for a few seconds. The music isn't continious, it goes in sprints too. It's almost like a live band following along with what Tony's doing. I kind of miss the good steady beat, but it seems in P90X the music isn't a big factor. Like some of the others... I will probably substitute the cardio days with Cathe for the higher fun factor. In spite of my honest criticizms here, my vote: go for it 
sanchiababy
Cathlete
Hello Kathryn,
200 workout videos, Kathryn?! Now I don't feel like such a freak. I thought I was the only one. I think I have over 300 workout videos now myself (I don't dare count either!). But at the top of that long list: Cathe and P90X (with the Firm close behind).
Sanchia
200 workout videos, Kathryn?! Now I don't feel like such a freak. I thought I was the only one. I think I have over 300 workout videos now myself (I don't dare count either!). But at the top of that long list: Cathe and P90X (with the Firm close behind).
Sanchia
These are my impressions after using P90X. At this time I blend both P90X and Cathe.
Strength- as intense as you make them. P90X is a well designed gym style strength workout series with some weight work and some body resistance exercises. Difficulty will depend on how new some of theses exercises are for you and what shape you are in. I have done many of these exercises before so, I didn't get the DOMS or drastic changes that some people experienced. There are modifications for exercises and equipment.
*chest & back, shoulders & arms, back & biceps, and chest, shoulders, triceps (these are broken down like existing Cathe workouts)- rep speed is on your own most of the time so, it is easier to go heavy.
*legs and back- lost muscle tone. Substituted Cathe's leg workout for better results and killer DOMS.
*ARX- tough abdominal workout but got bored with the same old same old. Substituted Cathe's abd for variety.
*core synergistics- I like this workout. It adds functional fitness and strength. Since I use this in my regular rotation, I will sub in TLP videos on my rest weeks.
*yoga x- this one peaked my interest in yoga but 90 minutes is too long. Looking for a sub, any suggestions?
*stretch x- thorough stretch. I break it up because I've run out of days in the week.
Cardio- for me Cathe is more intense (so is Christi, Janis & many others).
*plyo x- I felt that during plyo x I needed to hit the pause button just to let the video participants catch their breath. Get a better workout from Cathe. I sub in the IMAX's.
*cardio x- as someone on another board said... where's the cardio.
*kenpo- I like this one but since this series lacks enough cardio for me, I use KPC.
P90X cardio was not a good match for me. Still good workouts. These are probably meant to save on muscle breakdown.
I agree with the people that say they'll never need another series. However, I will add from Tony Horton at the end of that statement. I sub for too many workouts from this series to buy another.
If Cathe's hardcore gym style workouts are at a slower speed, these workouts will be used for muscle confusion. I think they compliment each other. I don't experience any fun factor with P90X alone. I add Cathe for intensity and fun.
I would say buy them if they interest you, you want some variety, and you want to spend the money. If you really like Cathe and want to save money, wait for the hardcore series. You might get what you need from Cathe. P90X isn't going anywhere. Or compromise and buy a few.
JMO
Strength- as intense as you make them. P90X is a well designed gym style strength workout series with some weight work and some body resistance exercises. Difficulty will depend on how new some of theses exercises are for you and what shape you are in. I have done many of these exercises before so, I didn't get the DOMS or drastic changes that some people experienced. There are modifications for exercises and equipment.
*chest & back, shoulders & arms, back & biceps, and chest, shoulders, triceps (these are broken down like existing Cathe workouts)- rep speed is on your own most of the time so, it is easier to go heavy.
*legs and back- lost muscle tone. Substituted Cathe's leg workout for better results and killer DOMS.
*ARX- tough abdominal workout but got bored with the same old same old. Substituted Cathe's abd for variety.
*core synergistics- I like this workout. It adds functional fitness and strength. Since I use this in my regular rotation, I will sub in TLP videos on my rest weeks.
*yoga x- this one peaked my interest in yoga but 90 minutes is too long. Looking for a sub, any suggestions?
*stretch x- thorough stretch. I break it up because I've run out of days in the week.
Cardio- for me Cathe is more intense (so is Christi, Janis & many others).
*plyo x- I felt that during plyo x I needed to hit the pause button just to let the video participants catch their breath. Get a better workout from Cathe. I sub in the IMAX's.
*cardio x- as someone on another board said... where's the cardio.
*kenpo- I like this one but since this series lacks enough cardio for me, I use KPC.
P90X cardio was not a good match for me. Still good workouts. These are probably meant to save on muscle breakdown.
I agree with the people that say they'll never need another series. However, I will add from Tony Horton at the end of that statement. I sub for too many workouts from this series to buy another.
If Cathe's hardcore gym style workouts are at a slower speed, these workouts will be used for muscle confusion. I think they compliment each other. I don't experience any fun factor with P90X alone. I add Cathe for intensity and fun.
I would say buy them if they interest you, you want some variety, and you want to spend the money. If you really like Cathe and want to save money, wait for the hardcore series. You might get what you need from Cathe. P90X isn't going anywhere. Or compromise and buy a few.
JMO
kathryn
Cathlete
>Kathryn (forgive me for speaking for you) has done heavy
>one-arm rows as a substitution as well.
Fine with me!
I have also done pullovers as subs for the back work.
I progressed through doing 1-arm rows and pullovers (when I had neither bands nor a tower), to pulldowns with a band (making sure to do an isometric hold at the bottom and resist the return of the band); to a combo of pull-ups/chin-ups and band pulldowns (I still like to do about half of the pull-ups/chin-ups as pulldowns because I can get in a nice number, where with pull-ups/chin-ups, I'm rather pathetic!)
>one-arm rows as a substitution as well.
Fine with me!
I have also done pullovers as subs for the back work.
I progressed through doing 1-arm rows and pullovers (when I had neither bands nor a tower), to pulldowns with a band (making sure to do an isometric hold at the bottom and resist the return of the band); to a combo of pull-ups/chin-ups and band pulldowns (I still like to do about half of the pull-ups/chin-ups as pulldowns because I can get in a nice number, where with pull-ups/chin-ups, I'm rather pathetic!)
>*yoga x- this one peaked my interest in yoga but 90 minutes is
>too long. Looking for a sub, any suggestions?
>
Hi,
Been doing Cathe for years and doing p90x for a couple of weeks. I have many of the same general impressions you do.
I think the yoga x is a cloaked strength workout - for yoga subs try:
Eoin Finn - Power yoga for Happiness, which has somewhere around six different workouts in the dvd of varying lengths (30 to 80 minutes) - if you're not familiar with Eoin, he is a trip - www.vancouveryoga.com is the website, I think.
His first video also has a longer workout plus a 45 minute one on the dvd. Both have a nice variety of poses. Eoin also has free downloads on his website.
David Swenson Short Forms - this one's a classic - a 15, 30 and 45 minute workout with a very nice 10 minutes relaxation at the end.
Baron Baptiste and Bryan Kest also have a variety of videos from which to choose - they both have very different presentations which you may really like or dislike.....
The thing I really like about p90x is the fact that the weight work goes at your own pace, and while he emphasizes good form, I've been able to really make significant strength gains that I haven't been able to do with Cathe because I don't have to stay in a cadence - he takes little breaks to get through his set, again, not sacrificing form. This has been tremendously helpful for me. I did MIS last week and went heavier than I ever have without the usual pain factor that is associated with that workout, so feel that p90x has really made a big difference. (Although I'm not sure I'll ever be able to do crazy eights and tricep extensions with a blasted 35 lb barbell to speed! )
hth,
Colia
>too long. Looking for a sub, any suggestions?
>
Hi,
Been doing Cathe for years and doing p90x for a couple of weeks. I have many of the same general impressions you do.
I think the yoga x is a cloaked strength workout - for yoga subs try:
Eoin Finn - Power yoga for Happiness, which has somewhere around six different workouts in the dvd of varying lengths (30 to 80 minutes) - if you're not familiar with Eoin, he is a trip - www.vancouveryoga.com is the website, I think.
His first video also has a longer workout plus a 45 minute one on the dvd. Both have a nice variety of poses. Eoin also has free downloads on his website.
David Swenson Short Forms - this one's a classic - a 15, 30 and 45 minute workout with a very nice 10 minutes relaxation at the end.
Baron Baptiste and Bryan Kest also have a variety of videos from which to choose - they both have very different presentations which you may really like or dislike.....
The thing I really like about p90x is the fact that the weight work goes at your own pace, and while he emphasizes good form, I've been able to really make significant strength gains that I haven't been able to do with Cathe because I don't have to stay in a cadence - he takes little breaks to get through his set, again, not sacrificing form. This has been tremendously helpful for me. I did MIS last week and went heavier than I ever have without the usual pain factor that is associated with that workout, so feel that p90x has really made a big difference. (Although I'm not sure I'll ever be able to do crazy eights and tricep extensions with a blasted 35 lb barbell to speed! )
hth,
Colia
Sharon- Glad to know you share my impressions. I also ordered the Hardcore series, I'll be anxiously waiting with you.
Colia- Thank you very much for the suggestions. I've looked into them. I hear Eoin Finn calling to my credit card.
Stacy- Have you made a decision yet? Ahhh, to bring it or not to bring it, that is the question.......
Colia- Thank you very much for the suggestions. I've looked into them. I hear Eoin Finn calling to my credit card.
Stacy- Have you made a decision yet? Ahhh, to bring it or not to bring it, that is the question.......
naughtoj
Cathlete
Jordan...
That really is a great breakdown. I could have written the same post!!! Curious though, how heavy are you lifting, say for the Shoulders/Arms tape? My biceps are pretty sore after this one, even though I have done those exercises before and I am in good shape. I use between 18 and 20# per arm for the curl-type movements. Because of your statement, I was curious of your weight load.
Are you all finding that with P90X your weight loads seem HUGE in comparison to Cathe?? I am.
That really is a great breakdown. I could have written the same post!!! Curious though, how heavy are you lifting, say for the Shoulders/Arms tape? My biceps are pretty sore after this one, even though I have done those exercises before and I am in good shape. I use between 18 and 20# per arm for the curl-type movements. Because of your statement, I was curious of your weight load.
Are you all finding that with P90X your weight loads seem HUGE in comparison to Cathe?? I am.
kathryn
Cathlete
Are you all finding that with P90X your weight
>loads seem HUGE in comparison to Cathe?? I am.
Definitely! I feel like a real amazon when I do P90X. I even had to go out and buy a 35# dumbbell (just one, though). I also add platemates to it sometimes to get 37.5# for 1-arm rows (or as Tony calls them, "lawnmowers." )
I'm also lifting MUCH more in my tricep extension exercises.
>loads seem HUGE in comparison to Cathe?? I am.
Definitely! I feel like a real amazon when I do P90X. I even had to go out and buy a 35# dumbbell (just one, though). I also add platemates to it sometimes to get 37.5# for 1-arm rows (or as Tony calls them, "lawnmowers." )
I'm also lifting MUCH more in my tricep extension exercises.
Curious though, how heavy are you
>lifting, say for the Shoulders/Arms tape?
>
>
> Are you all finding that with P90X your weight
>loads seem HUGE in comparison to Cathe?? I am.
My sheet is upstairs in my workout room. So, I'll do it by memory. When I hear an exercise I can usually tell how much weight I can lift. Somedays I can tell it's time to go heavier and other days I know I need to lighten up. I started lighter at first because I was recorving from minor surgery and hadn't worked out in a couple of weeks. I adjust for endurance and strength workouts. Also, I start lighter when I'm trying a new workout. Huge in comparison to Cathe? Hmmm, I see the potential. I really started out light to avoid injury and to let my body recover.
Shoulders- 8lb-15lb DB
Triceps- 10lb-12lb DB (I think I may have used 8lbs for an exercise)
Biceps- 15-20lb DB (I wish I had 18lb DB. I did make some out of an old set but they are too bulky. May have used 12lbs the first week for some exercises.)
>lifting, say for the Shoulders/Arms tape?
>
>
> Are you all finding that with P90X your weight
>loads seem HUGE in comparison to Cathe?? I am.
My sheet is upstairs in my workout room. So, I'll do it by memory. When I hear an exercise I can usually tell how much weight I can lift. Somedays I can tell it's time to go heavier and other days I know I need to lighten up. I started lighter at first because I was recorving from minor surgery and hadn't worked out in a couple of weeks. I adjust for endurance and strength workouts. Also, I start lighter when I'm trying a new workout. Huge in comparison to Cathe? Hmmm, I see the potential. I really started out light to avoid injury and to let my body recover.
Shoulders- 8lb-15lb DB
Triceps- 10lb-12lb DB (I think I may have used 8lbs for an exercise)
Biceps- 15-20lb DB (I wish I had 18lb DB. I did make some out of an old set but they are too bulky. May have used 12lbs the first week for some exercises.)
kathryn
Cathlete
>Biceps- 15-20lb DB (I wish I had 18lb DB. I did make some out
>of an old set but they are too bulky. May have used 12lbs the
>first week for some exercises.)
>
Jordan, do you have Platemates? I have a couple pairs of them that let me turn my 15# db into 17.5#, which is a much nicer increase than from 15# to 20# (as you have probably discovered!) If you have some wrist weights around, you could also use those to create intermediate weights by putting 1# or 2# or 3# or even 4# on your wrist while hoisting the 15# dumbbell.
You know what, I think I just talked MYSELF into getting an adjustible wrist weight!! How did that happen? That ability to increase weight by just 1# several times just sounds so tempting!
>of an old set but they are too bulky. May have used 12lbs the
>first week for some exercises.)
>
Jordan, do you have Platemates? I have a couple pairs of them that let me turn my 15# db into 17.5#, which is a much nicer increase than from 15# to 20# (as you have probably discovered!) If you have some wrist weights around, you could also use those to create intermediate weights by putting 1# or 2# or 3# or even 4# on your wrist while hoisting the 15# dumbbell.
You know what, I think I just talked MYSELF into getting an adjustible wrist weight!!
How did that happen? That ability to increase weight by just 1# several times just sounds so tempting!
C
Carol_is_fit
Guest
I've been following this from the beginning, kind of hanging around the fringes to see if this is something I should buy. Jordan, I can't tell you how much I appreciate your candid and concise post! It really summed it all up for me in a way nothing else did, on this forum or others. It also helped me realize that my first instincts on this series were right. It's just not for me. I did go to their website some time ago and explore it, and that was my first thought. There is nothing there I can't already get with all the Cathe and old Firm and TLP and yoga tapes I already own. Thanks for breaking it down like this!
As for pull-ups (which is the one exercise missing from Cathe and the Firm and TLP) , I already have great traps and lats since I have a tendency to bulk on my upper body, so I don't think pull-ups are what I personally need anyway! I'd look like a linebacker!! LOL!! NOT attractive on a woman who is only 5'2" - LOL!! I love to work my legs too and I like to keep them the way they are - you can see my quad muscles even when they're not flexed, so I appreciate knowing this series doesn't match Cathe's work for legs. I would miss the cardio, since I LOVE Cathe's circuit work and the circuit-type work in Functional Strength and Power, and Dynamic Strength, so this is another reason P90X is not for me. I just can't see spending the money for what sounds like workouts I already have. As to varying speed and counts with strength training, I do that all the time with Cathe! There are days I simply don't feel like lifting as quickly so I slow down and go heavier. Or, there are days I feel like lifting more quickly, so I back off on the weight and go at my own pace. I know her workouts so well now that the music isn't an issue. Plus, there are so many to choose from! If I want endurance I choose Power Hour or ME. If I want to really lift as heavy as I can, I do the Pyramids or Slow & Heavy. If I want something in between I do Pure Strength. And, for the days when I miss the total body working out experience, I do Step, Jump & Pump, or Boot Camp, or Cardio & Weights. I guess my point is, with Cathe and my old firms and TLP, I have all the stuff P90X has, without Tony Horton's delivery! LOL!
Anyway ... thanks again!! I'm glad I pre-ordered the Hardcore series instead!!!
Carol
As for pull-ups (which is the one exercise missing from Cathe and the Firm and TLP) , I already have great traps and lats since I have a tendency to bulk on my upper body, so I don't think pull-ups are what I personally need anyway! I'd look like a linebacker!! LOL!! NOT attractive on a woman who is only 5'2" - LOL!! I love to work my legs too and I like to keep them the way they are - you can see my quad muscles even when they're not flexed, so I appreciate knowing this series doesn't match Cathe's work for legs. I would miss the cardio, since I LOVE Cathe's circuit work and the circuit-type work in Functional Strength and Power, and Dynamic Strength, so this is another reason P90X is not for me. I just can't see spending the money for what sounds like workouts I already have. As to varying speed and counts with strength training, I do that all the time with Cathe! There are days I simply don't feel like lifting as quickly so I slow down and go heavier. Or, there are days I feel like lifting more quickly, so I back off on the weight and go at my own pace. I know her workouts so well now that the music isn't an issue. Plus, there are so many to choose from! If I want endurance I choose Power Hour or ME. If I want to really lift as heavy as I can, I do the Pyramids or Slow & Heavy. If I want something in between I do Pure Strength. And, for the days when I miss the total body working out experience, I do Step, Jump & Pump, or Boot Camp, or Cardio & Weights. I guess my point is, with Cathe and my old firms and TLP, I have all the stuff P90X has, without Tony Horton's delivery! LOL!
Anyway ... thanks again!! I'm glad I pre-ordered the Hardcore series instead!!!
Carol