Please help me - this is very long

H

HopefulMum

Member
I was talking to my DH yesterday about starting a savings plan and he turned round and said he was not ready to start trying for a baby afterall. I was shocked and disappointed at his news, especially as his reasons for wanting to delay (indefinitely) are purely selfish.

We had both decided 6 months ago to start trying. DH, at the time, was very keen on the idea. The first month we tried I was obsessed with ovulation charts etc.. and day 14 and put too much pressure on us both. I can honestly say since then I have not put any pressure on us at all and we had been relaxed about the whole thing - or so I thought. Of course I would get upset that I wasn't pregnant every month which I feel is only natural. I am only human and I have feelings.

I am so angry and upset with him. I want a baby more than anything in the world and for all the right reasons. I think he's being selfish and insensitive about this and many other issues that I will not bore you with. He's expecting things to just go back to normal now and expects me to run with it yet fails to appreciate that I am human with feelings and this is a huge disappointment.

The other thing is I'm 29 this year and had not wanted to wait much longer to try for a first. Of course men have the luxury of being able to wait indefinitely whereas no woman does. It seems no man can really understand the true meaning of a woman's clock ticking and men can be so cruel and insensitive about this. It all seems so terribly unfair. I know I'm not 40 yet but that's not the point. I do not want to wait till I'm much older to start trying for children but DH just does not understand that.

This as well as many other fundamental differences which have marred our 4 year marriage are seriously making me think I made the wrong decision marrying my DH. It seems I'm expected to make all/many of the compromises, be ultra-patient and tolerant etc..Every time we have an argument he turns everything around so it's me who's in the wrong when quite often it's his fault/he's to blame. My self-esteem is at an all time low - I used to be a confident and beautiful person who really believed she was a godd person. My marriage has made me feel unworthy to be loved and worthless, as if I'm so fundamentally flawed I'm incredibly hard work to be with.

I am absolutely distraught and devastated by the news and my eyes are red with having cried much of last night. I hardly slept yesterday evening. Meanwhile, DH was out clubbing with his friends! I am stunned by how heartless this man is. He is sound asleep as I type this and I feel like killing him for being such a bxxxxxd.

The other thing is that DH is extremely lucky to have me at all. I married into (his) awful family where his father had 9 wives and over 35 children (and counting). My background is a monogamous and loving home and I have always struggled to get on with DH's mother whereas my mother and DH get on well. Many if not all his attitudes are linked to the way he was brought up and I'm losing my sanity with it all. My mum is a lot more laid back and relaxed and less rigid than Dh's. Every time I speak to DH's mum it's ME not DH that she asks why we haven't got children. I have tolerated this for years and have now had enough. Next time she says that I'll ask her to talk to her precious son about it since I'm the one who wants a family and he doesn't.

What do you ladies advice? I know that I've given a lot of information and that yet at the same time you don't know me personally but please can you help? I feel as if I'm losing my sanity and am on the brink of leaving my husband and adopting or fostering children. If I do leave him, I am NEVER going to get married EVER again and do not ever want to be with another man again. I feel as if I have wasted 7 years of my life with this man and am extremely bitter and angry about it.

How would you ladies feel if you were facing this situation? Please please advise if you can as I am so distraught.
 
I think many of us that are married, or are in a serious relationship have felt "similar" to the way you're feeling, just with a different issue. As far as ending your marriage over it, I think you need some time to think about this in a less emotional state. I know you're in a tremondous amount of pain, so that will be difficult. My first husband did not want children, but being young and naive, I figured I would either bring him around or just have them. I ended up just getting pregnant, which destoyed his trust in me, and ultimately our marriage ended. He always loved and cared for his son, but because of his family history and childhood, he did NOT want to have a child. I will tell you when you're pregnant, your emotions run VERY HIGH, and when you are with a partner who is not supportive, it can be very depressing. I have since had 4 more children, different husband, who loves children and it was a very different experience. You're still very young for you to be worrying about your biological clock. I would concentrate on your marriage right now. I would suggest Dr. Phil Mcgraw's Relationship Rescue, because it will help you become more aware of what is really important to you and whether you and your husband have real issues (but then who doesn't!!!) that need to be addressed. Raising and having children on my own has not been my experience, but even with having someone there it has its difficult moments. I feel your pain and disappointment and I truly hope you weigh your feelings carefully.
 
Hi HM!

I am so sorry about the hurt and frustration you are going through right now. I agree with Jackie that you still have time as far as your biological time clock. I know that is easy for me to say but I guess I hate to see you make a decision right now when it seems there are many issues you need to deal with before getting pregnant. I think it would help greatly for you to go for some kind of counseling so you can deal with your distraught feelings. I'm sorry, I know this isn't what you want to hear. I just feel your pain in your words and hope and pray that it will all work out eventually for you both. Wish I knew what else to say. Just wanting you to know I a thinking of you. A big hug for you!!!

Your-Friend-In-Fitness, DebbieH http://www.plaudersmilies.de/wavey.gif If You Get The Choice To Sit It Out Or Dance...I Hope You DANCE!!!
 
I am so sorry to hear your pain. While we can't really know what to tell you definitively, I had two thoughts. Demand that you two get counselling - through your church if you have one, or through a reputable counselor. Second, please, don't have any children until you get your marital issues resolved - having a baby in this environment will not be fair to anyone, especially the little one. I apologize if that sounds harsh, but I've seen this scenario played out too many times - a baby will not fix any problems.

If your husband refuses to go to counselling, then perhaps you'll have to decide whether you can accept him for who he is, because he isn't likely to change or not.

Lastly, remember, your self-value doesn't come from your husband - it comes really from God and from YOU! Don't let anyone take that away from you, okay?

Hoping for all the best for you!
Colia
 
There's not much more I can say that hasn't already been said, but I have to agree that your marriage is the thing that needs your attention right now; try to let the baby issue slide. As much as you might have wanted to have a baby by now, the circumstances of your life are not at all conducive to that. You are ONLY 29, which, biologically speaking, still gives you a lot of time to straighten out your life AND have children, one day in the future. But now is clearly not the time. I also think that therapy can help you relax and focus on solving your marital problems, so do try to seek some help.

As for your husband behaving insensitively, this may be his way of emotionally distancing himself from an issue he's not prepared to address. A therapist may be able to advise you on how to connect with him mentally and emotionally, so that you can decide what you need to do.

Good luck, and remember the woman you used to think you are. You still are Her!
 
[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON Feb-10-02 AT 09:40AM (Est)[/font][p]I have to totally agree with what Colia said. DO NOT GET PREGNANT UNTIL YOU HAVE TRIED COUNSELING! Either with your husband or by yourself. Only you can decide if your relationship is worth salvaging and bringing a child into it at this point won't help. It sounds like your husband is right about one thing though. He is not ready for a child (and may be never be)as long as he acts in such a self-centered way. There is life after divorce--been there, done that. And there are some wonderful, caring men out there. Don't give up. Good luck and take care!

Oh, and tell your mother-in-law (in a respectful way, of course) to MIND HER OWN BUSINESS.
[font color=green]BETSY[/font]
 
From an outsider looking in, you sound beyond frustrated with your life and his ability to make you feel so bad. Life is short and if there is no answer that will work for both of you...move on. DON'T have a baby with someone that does this to you now, because as wonderful as they are, babies can be very stressful to a marriage for the first little while, especailly the first one. I'm sure nothing will break your heart more than the daddy of your baby being indifferent to him or her and you.

Maybe you need to get away by yourself and think things thru. When making such big desions I think doing what is best for YOU is very important.
 
Thank you all for your insightful comments

Even more things have happened since the weekend which have left no doubt in my mind that DH and I have very different ideas about what being married actually means and about family life and commitments. All our differences stem from our totally different family backgrounds - his values are totally alient to me and I see that so clearly now. I do not see how this can ever be resolved now.

Everyone is advising me to leave him, even my mum, who has always stood up for him in the past and tried to encourage me to make a go of things regardless. I have not slept properly since the weekend and it's beginning to affect me at work and just generally dealing with day to day life. The bottom line is that DH is an incredibly selfish man who is not prepared to make any of the loving compromises that I have made throughout the marriage and relationship. It now seems that the baby issue merely highlighted the fact that he has always felt trapped in the marriage and had hoped to continue the bachelor lifestyle (staying out all night with his single male friends and doing anything he wanted) whilst at the same time having none of the responsibilities of married life but all of the privileges.

I am absolutely petrified of being on my own but am slowly going insane in this relationship and have to leave.

Please tell me there's life after divorce - I'm 28 and feel as if I've now wasted the best years of my life and am condemned to being alone and childless for the rest of my life. I feel so bitter that I spent 7 years of my life with this man who has treated me so shabbily when I had so many options and so much interest from other, more eligible bachelors when I was younger. Now I feel that I have wasted 7 years and have nothing to show for it.

Can anyone suggest any books that will help? Any online counselling facilities? My life has been turned upside down and so much of what I believed has been proven to be false.

Cathe, I am sorry to post such a depressing message like this on one of your boards.
 
RE: Thank you all for your insightful comments

I'm sorry that I don't have any magic words for your situation, but I will say that you are SO LUCKY to have figured all this out before becoming pregnant with this man. I encourage you to seek counseling for yourself. This will help you sort out your emotions and I'm sure that you will realize that you have not wasted the best years of your life and you are not destined to a life without children. You are just not in a healthy emotional state right now. Believe it or not, you have already started the healing process by realizing that you may need to move on from this relationship and that no amount of love, support, tolerance or compromise on your part will change who your husband is or what his values are and that they don't match your vision of how your life should be. That in itself is a big step toward creating the life you want. Good luck to you and just know that you are stronger than you think you are.
 
RE: Thank you all for your insightful comments

Please know that you have not wasted the best years of your life - if you use your experiences to learn about yourself and what is important to you. Remember too, that in the future, you may be able to help someone else out by your experiences - that's hard to think about now, but use all this not to become embittered, but to become more wise.

To finish the sermon, I just wanted to let you know that I did not marry until I was 39, and I'm glad I waited for the right person. I enjoyed my single years and did a lot of things that I might not have otherwise done had I been married. So please don't give up hope if you choose to leave this man - there is life beyond marriage! I would also suggest that you find some counselling in person - I think real human contact would be beneficial for you at this time.

I promise this is the last piece of advice - don't isolate yourself either - let friend and family support you - being alone can add to the depression. You might also want to consider doing some volunteer type of work - many people find that when they reach out to others, they find a whole new meaning in life, and are able to focus on something other than their own problems. Keep us posted and....

Hang in there!
Colia
 
For what it's worth

Reading your post makes my heart ache. I want to assure you that the best years of your life are still ahead of you and urge you not to think of the time you have spent with this man as wasted. Everything we do and every choice we make in life makes us the person we are at any given moment in time. If you had not spent these years in this relationship, you may not have had the life experiences that would have shown you what kind of relationship you really want and deserve. You might still be attracted to immature men who want to continue to behave like college frat boys and ignore the feelings and sensibilities of the person they've promised to honor for the rest of their lives. Trust me, some women never get the message. You are obvious very intelligent and self-aware to have come to the realization you have. I usually don't get my life advice from Oprah, but I do recall her saying one thing that has always stuck with me -- "When I was younger I did what I knew, and when I knew better, I did better." So please don't beat yourself up or despair.

It's obvious from your post that you are in a very heightened emotional state right now. My suggestion would be to take a deep breath and a step back to give yourself time to think both with your mind and your heart. It sounds like even being around your husband is fueling the fire. Is there someone you could stay with briefly so you could get some distance from him and the situation for a short while -- your mom, a girlfriend? This might help you clear your head a bit. I also echo the suggestion for counseling. If you have never been, I can tell you that there is nothing as liberating and affirming as being able to air your feelings in a non-judgmental and accepting atmosphere -- it is truly cathartic. I also agree that personal counseling is probably indicated for a situation this charged and complex. If you think you can't afford the cost, is there another trusted person you could speak to, such as your clergyman? Also, you might see if your employer provides this type of service (many employers provide access to crisis counselors either free or for a nominal fee). If you could convince your husband to go with you, great, but if he's unwilling (which it sounds like he would be), go yourself.

Finally, please turn to your friends and family and ask for their help. Being "on your own" is not the same thing as being alone. You are stronger than you know. God bless and please let us know how you are doing.
 
Thank you again.

Thank you all again.

You were correct, Hazel - being in the same house with him was really driving me mad and preventing me from sleeping etc.. - I was even more infuriated by the fact that he can sleep like a baby, in spite of all this - grrrrr. I went to my mother’s house (she’s working away from home at the moment and my student brother is house-sitting for her). That has kept me sane so far this week and now at least I am getting enough sleep to get through the day at work.

Because communication has been gradually breaking down with my H over the last few months anyway and all our recent discussions have been about all the things I do wrong and have to change (nothing from him), I left him an honest, fair but direct letter on Monday evening. He has since read the letter and has been sending loads of voicemails trying to contact me, initially leaving stupid, childish and angry messages but eventually sounding really hysterical and panicky - he had no idea where I was, you see, and really thought that I would be home on Monday night after work. He has been really shocked by the fact that I was not home and have not been to our house since Monday and now realises that I am deadly serious about leaving him if this rubbish continues. I have not felt ready to talk to him at all and realise that I will only discuss these issues with him with an independent third party counsellor present - I stated that in my letter. We went to counselling last year but it was a totally different format to what I am proposing now as the only way forward - last year, it was a group discussion followed by discussions between couples only about key issues yet without any third party input at all. Clearly all H has done is noted the things I had to change which I have but has still not accepted where he himself is so blatantly at fault. A counselling format where we are both in front of a third party who will record our discussions (so H can’t back out later) and hold him accountable is the only way forward. I have asked H to make changes till I am blue in the face and he still refuses to see what is wrong with spending all weekend clubbing with his single friends whilst leaving his wife at home, for example!

I have given H an ultimatum - if he is not ready to go to proper counselling and does not let me know by the end of this month, then that is the end of our marriage. There are many key issues I will not bore you with other than the clubbing, which would need to change, all of which indicate that he feels trapped being married and is still feeling like one of the single boys. This was never my idea of married life and I truly deserve so much more. I made so many sacrifices for him and people thought I was mad but I made them out of love and because I thought he was worth it at the time. At the time, he really appreciated the sacrifices I made. Yet somehow now , those very sacrifices are being taken for granted and dismissed - his exact words were “big deal”. If I were to tell you all what I gave up to be with him, you would truly understand why this hurt so much.

I expected to make mutual and loving compromises in marriage but now find myself being the only one always making the effort.

So that is where we stand at the moment - I definitely need space away from him as the very sound of his voice and the sight of him right now makes me want to grab a knife and stab him.

Anyway, ladies, this post is quite long enough, but I want to say thank you so very much for your responses and that I would very much welcome any more advice you might have for me.

Thanks again.
 
RE: Thank you all for your insightful comments

Hi Hopefulmum,
Sounds like you married the exact same man that my cousin married. She too wanted a child but realized he would not be too good of a father. Just wanted you to know that she divorced and ended up just one year later marrying her old high school sweetheart! They have been happily married now for 12 or so years with a gorgeous 8 year old daughter. They are one of the best couples I know. Please don't give up hope. You may end up with a much happier, satisfying life with someone new and possibly some children too. Or you may end up being happy by yourself. I certainly know alot of people that are completely happy by themselves and would never change a thing. Either way, whatever path YOU desire YOU will surely find it!! I'm wishing you the best. Take care.
Lisa
 
RE: Thank you again.

Good for you taking that big step! Are you familiar with the books of Phil McGraw? He has a couple of good books out, and I would urge you to check him out.

It will be fine...there ARE good guys out there, and you don't have to settle for an abusive one. You'll be fine, just keep in close touch with your support people.
 
Please help - again

My husband and I spoke on the ‘phone at length on Saturday morning (5 hours). He is finally accepting and admitting that he has been the one at fault and has offered to see a psychiatrist on his own. There are a myriad of issues directly linked to his childhood/upbringing which he has never addressed and which have affected the way he sees me and views marriage generally. In view of this, we both now no longer feel that going to couples counselling again would help, since the issues lie with him on this occasion.

My biggest problem now is that I am so sceptical about this all working. I have moved back into the house now and we have laid down some ground rules which have been written down so no-one (ie my husband) can back track later. But this man has caused me so much pain that I am wondering if I will ever feel the same way about him again. It is so difficult to shake the pain away and to be positive about all of this.

It is clear that he was the one getting any benefit from the relationship whereas I was the one cursed with all the burdens. My instincts tell me this may never change but I must now wait and see what happens as a result of seeing the psychiatrist. A part of me cannot help feeling that my husband may have once again manipulated me and twisted the whole situation around, albeit this time he’s accepting responsibility for his actions. Is this man just taking advantage again and deluding both himself and me? All my friends told me to leave him and all his friends told him he was at fault and needed to sort himself out, was being selfish, never deserved me etc..My feeling though is that people seem so quick to tell you to leave your partner but are then not really there to support you once you have left and you are a real mess after divorce, regardless of who was responsible for the marriage breakdown.

I am so sorry ladies that this sorrowful thread continues but I am distraught once again and do not know what to believe - have any of you been in this situation? Do you advise me to give this just one last shot and if things still do not change, leave, with all the regret and other emotions that entails? I would really welcome and appreciate your thoughts and feel as if I am still on an emotional rollercoaster.
 
RE: Please help - again

DO NOT leave him until you have exhasted all other options. Time and time again I have spoken with divorced people who wished they would have done things differently/tried harder. Not that they are not happy now, most of them are but hold true regret over past actions and hurts. Divorce is not an answer, it is an alternative. You exchange one set of pains for another. Friends who recommend you leave him do not often recognize the problems you buy when you do that and are not ready to handle them - that's why you see lack of support after the fact.

I do not want to appear that I put any blame on you, but every relationship takes two people. I would still recommend you seek counseling either by yourself or together. Improving communication skills together could help you two from getting to a crisis point where it comes down to ultimatums. Certainly his seeking counseling for past views will help, but you still have to get to a point where you can discuss things together effectively.

All advice aside - only YOU can decide if it's right to stick around or leave. Your family, friends, and net pals do not have to deal with the emotions of your life - only you - so make sure when you make a decision that you own it yourself and not do it because it was the consenses of the people around you.

One last thing - 'I am wondering if I will ever feel the same way about him again'. Probably not - scars change people, but that doesn't mean you can't come to a deep love with him again. Love is a choice, not an emotion. When you get to the point that you can trust him with your love again, you will. I just hope you will get to a point where you are willing to risk the hurt again since nothing worth obtaining is without risk or work.
 
RE: Please help - again

This a little late and I don't know how helpful but...I just try to be very cautious when I talk with my friends about any marital issue if they are not married or never have been. My very best friend is wonderful and loves my husband dearly but when we are having "issues", she is so defensive of me that she often says, "well, you may just have to leave him one day." I love her, but I have found that not only she but other single friends don't yet get the whole marriage thing. Just something to consider.

I would agree with the others who responded that taking care of your marriage is the priority. One of the greatest gifts you can give to any child (married or not) is to let them know that they are not only loved but wanted. I'm 31 going on 32 and pregnant with my first child. My husband is 35 going on 36 and though I know he loves me and wants children, I had to give him time to adjust to the enormity and finality of it - just like getting married! I was ready back in the spring and summer of 2001 but he wasn't. It was hard to be patient but, for me, it had to be a mutual desire and readiness.

My thoughts and prayers are with you and I'm sure your marriage appreciates how you're trying to go about it.
 
RE: Please help - again

I find it very encouraging that your husband appears to be willing on doing some difficult work in order to save your marriage. Hooray for him! Just like pet training, positive reinforcement is always better than negative - so remember that if he is truly trying. He's not going to change overnight - and neither are your feelings. It is perfectly understanding that you remain skeptical - and perhaps you should. But I agree that marriage is a commitment, and as long as he is making an effort, so should you. You might want to think about things that could help you cope while the wounds are still angry, about things you mights have done differently in your situation, and ways you can help him now. What kind of a wife do you think you should be? Are you there yet? (I know I'm not!) What are things you can do to improve? It's always easy to point out faults in others, much harder to take a good hard look at ourselves - I think he will appreciate this from you, as he is doing himself and I strongly agree that you two should be in counselling together - while he's got his issues to deal with - you two have got a lot of issues that must be dealt with together - it's not just his problem - it's yours together! There may be ways you can help him, that you may not realize and vice versa. He probably still lacks insight into all of what you've been through and need - couples counselling will help.

So, unless he remains abusive, you might be amazed at what good things can happen if you both work hard at it. You're going to have to start thinking about forgiving him at some point - until then, healing can't really begin for you. Forgiveness can be one of the hardest, but most liberating experiences in the world - and we all need to do it, because we all need to be forgiven as well! Please get some counselling yourself and for you together. Keep us posted!
 
RE: Please help - again

I just wanted to let you know that for as long as you decide to stay in your relationship, there is hope. My husband and I ran into serious issues about 9 years ago. There were days when it was hard for me to look at him without feeling betrayed. I stayed with him ONLY because we had a 1-1/2 yr old (I had already been divorced once with a young child and refused to put another child thru this). It took time, but he regained my trust, we had a 2nd child who is now 7 and I have the life I always dreamed of but never thot I would find. He is a wonderful man who has grown and changed into someone I love and respect. I learned my lessons too, and we've grown together.

I have two pieces of advice that helped me get thru things. Don't force yourself (or let your friends force you) to make a "quick" decision. You have time, take all the time you need. When I felt that my situation was unbearable and that I really had to do something, I would tell myself to wait til tomorrow to decide. Stringing lots of "tomorrows" together gave us both time to come to terms with our problems. The other piece of advice I have is to try to understand that you are a "team". I agree that couples couseling could be helpful because you need to understand what you could do differently and what you can do to help your teammate. Try not to be adversaries, but work together for a common goal.

If he is manipulating you, you can always make the decision to leave when you are ready, and on your terms. Hold off on any thoughts about kids for now. Once they are involved, you can never really walk away. If I had understood that my ex would be in my life until my son was grown - I would have stayed with him and worked it out. You have lots of time for kids. I was 21 when my first was born, and 39 when I had the last. I've learned so much about myself and grown so much, that I'm a much better mother to my younger children.

There is time, and people CAN change and forgiveness can come. Give yourself and him time and see what happens. You just might find a happy ending.

Best Wishes,
Lindy
 
RE: Please help - again

Just thought I'd chime in- sounds like you are wise and patient. If he values those qualities he will eventually realize it and show it. It would be wonderful for you if he started expressing gratitude, eh?

There's no way to predict the outcome. You sound like you will do the right thing no matter how it turns out. Being able to put your strong desires (for a child, and a loving husband) on the back burner shows your maturity and wisdom.

"The race is not always to the swift, nor is wisdom to the aged"- the Bible somewhere

God bless you and good luck.

-Connie
 
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