Not to beat a dead horse...

jillybean

jillybean

Cathlete
But there have been a lot of posts lately about cardio and weights. Kathy H. posted (and I trust her opinion) that you should never do cardio and weights on the same day.) I also trust Cathe's opinion and she has made videos with both components in one workout (Body Max, Cardio and Weights, etc.) So here are my questions: Should a person cut down on cardio when doing a strength-oriented rotation and keep cardio levels higher when doing endurance-type workouts? Here is my problem: I have more energy when doing strength workouts, which lends itself to doing more cardio. If I am doing Power Hour 3x's a week for example, it's hard to do much more than 120-140 min. of cardio a week because the high reps of endurance workouts exhaust me so. What is a girl to do? Thanks in advance for any responses!
 
I'm really confused about this now myself! I started with Cathe a year ago with Circuit Max and Body Max because I wanted to combine both cardio and weights in one workout. A guy that I work with had brought in an article in a fitness magazine which said that by combining the two, you burn more calories and lose more fat. Within 6 months I had lost 15 pounds, but gained that amount of weight in Cathe videos! I have good muscle definition and don't need to lose the weight. I still try to combine both cardio and weights in my workout, but sometimes I will do just cardio or just weights. Because of my initial success using this type of workout, I have been reluctant to let go of it and alternate cardio days and weight days.

Power Hour 3x's a week? OUCH!!!!!!!!! My quads went into spasm just thinking about it!

Like Jillybean, I'd welcome any responses.

Nancy
 
RE: Not to beat a dead aquajock . . .

I ALWAYS do cardio and weights in the same workout. Not to cop any attitude here, but the word "never" almost . . . well, never has a place in the world of fitness training. Much depends on a person's goals, physical structure and the quality of the workout. And I have strengthened up significantly over the past 2+ years that I've decreased my water training and increased my land training.

I prefer to do one circuit-style (leg circuits only) workout per week, one interval-style workout per week, and the third land workout swings between kickbox and hi/lo. I always do a total body strength routine after the interval and kickbox / hi-lo cardio that includes legs, abs and upper body. More often than not I'll skip leg strengthening after a leg-circuit workout because I've already gotten in a lot of weighted squats and lunges, but I'm increasingly wanting to stick a few minutes of those after the circuit workout as well; and of course I always do abs and upper body.

I'm probably in the minority here in that I don't have specified "strength / endurance" goals, or even distinctions, that many others do. However, for your purposes Jillybean, IMHO your strength goals are better served by Slow and Heavy. I'll double-check myself with Maribeth on this one, but I believe the research shows that strength training assists in endurance training, but the reverse is not true. I may be wrong on this, but Power Hour appears to me to be more of an endurance-style routine.

Just my $.02 -

Annette Q. Aquajock
 
RE: Not to beat a dead aquajock . . .

Thanks for the reply! I guess each person is different. If some people can manage a cario workout after doing Power Hour then more power to them. No pun intended. If they are fatigued, then they should do cardio and weights on alternate days. I agree with what you said and will be focusing more on strength and doing cardio as needed. Thanks again. And I would never beat you Aquajock. I might stand there in awe as you did power scissors around me, but I'd never beatcha!
 
RE: Not to beat a dead aquajock . . .

I've always done cardio and weights together too.

I began weight training with the Firm and lost tons of weight with their tapes (30 lbs). I'd alternate days, heavy and light weights, but always with cardio in there.

About 1 1/2 or 2 yrs. ago I heard of Cathe and began incorporating her workouts. But even on days that I do Cathe's weight tapes I also do the cardio.

That's always worked well for me.

Laura
 
Hi Jillybean! If your goal is to achieve MORE muscular strength and definition then you'll have to really intensify the weight training and if you want to become more cut and lean then you'll have to alternate your cardio and weight training days. When I want to take a break from all that intensity of weight lifting then I'll do an endurance rotation using Circuit Max, Power Hour, Body Max, etc. Cathe's tapes are AWESOME but I had to tweak them a bit; I'm not saying I don't do her tapes I most certainly do and have the greatest respect for her but everyone's goals are different. If your fine with the way you look, then you can certainly mix it up every 2-3 weeks by alternating heavy and light weight training days. Or you can do weight training in the a.m. and cardio in the p.m. or vice versa. My goals are different; I'm already lean and have a lot of muscles and if you looked at me you'd say I look good, but I want to look GREAT and that's why I do intense weight lifting; not a power lifter mind you but wanted to have much bigger muscles. You are the ONLY ONE that can determine what your body needs and what you want to experiment with to achieve your goals. I don't know what they are. There's no magic rotation as in one size fits all. Nutrition plays a very BIG role in this as you already know. I hope I've helped somewhat.

Cathe help me out here!!

Best, Kathy
 
A clarification then?

Okay, so you didn't actually say that one should never do cardio & weights on the same day, right? I didn't see whatever post is being referred to here so I was surely hoping there was just a misunderstanding somehow.

By the way, I personally love doing an intense cardio workout and then weights immediately thereafter. I just alternate between different sorts of weight workouts (Cathe makes it easy to get the variety) because I don't have any specific "goals" except to be lean, cut and (most importantly) just plain healthy & strong. Of course, things are a bit different now that I'm exercising for two :D!

Anyway, if I try to do an intense weight workout (even with a good warm-up) without doing some high energy cardio first, my body is never anywhere near warmed-up enough to be able to work as hard as I'm able. I figure it's just a matter of everybody's body being different and responding differently to whatever is thrown at them.

For myself, I find that if I do weights after my cardio, it greatly prolongs the fat & calorie burn which I've already got in high gear from the cardio, plus which I'm able to lift heavier and more efficiently so that I actually become more lean and more cut using that routine.
 
RE: My thoughts exactly, FoolofaTook

Like you, I'm a cardio-then-weights person. If I tried to do a full-blown weight workout, or even a split routine, without a kick-butt Cathe cardio workout to warm up I'd crystallize!

There's usually a subterranean debate in fitness circles about what is "better" - cardio THEN strength vs. strength THEN cardio, OR cardio and strength on separate days. The egos usually kick in during that debate, with various fitness pros stating what are essentially personal preferences as moral and scientific absolutes.

IMHO, you'll do better and see more fitness gains if you're honoring your personal workout preferences. If you like total workouts that include cardio, strength and flexibility components in each workout bout, you'll do great. And if you like splitting them into separate sessions in separate days, you'll do great. AND, if you like doing cardio first then strength you'll do great, AND if you like doing strength first then cardion you'll do great too. If you program the workouts in a manner you don't like, you WON'T do great.

Annette Q. Aquajock The Obscure
 
RE: My thoughts exactly, FoolofaTook

[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON Nov-22-02 AT 01:17PM (Est)[/font][p]Hey, I am glad to see there are more cardio then weight people out there. I have been doing it that way for at least six years. I have often read the articles that say weights first, then cardio. That sends shivers down my spine!

I can't imagine doing it that way for I would be afraid of being too tired to get my cardio in. I guess whatever works for each person and what that person is looking for.

This method has definitely worked for me. I will be 47 in a few weeks and I have ten children and I can still wear a half top and also a bikini. I have good muscle definition meaning that I am cut up. I do cardio every day and have been for about 20 years.
 
RE: My thoughts exactly, FoolofaTook

OK, let's get this straight? Is it ok to do cardio in the morning and weight work at night? Or, is it better to do cardio and weight work on different days? If I do cardio and weight work on different days, what am I going to achieve that I would not otherwise? Yesterday I did Slow and Heavy shoulders in the morning and then I did S&H bi's and tri's in the evening. This morning I did CTX kickbox and plan on doing S&H back and chest tonight, how is that? I'm reading all of your notes, but am still somewhat confused, so SPELL IT OUT someone please! I also am one of those people that will do cardio and go straight into the weights afterwards, especially at the gym. I've tried doing the strength training first and that did not work for me.
 
We are soooo individual!

Jilly bean and Annette you make good points!
I think what we have here is a very big vatiety of what works well for individual bodies.

If you are trying to put on muscle and you expend too many calories doing cardio, then it will not happen.

I personally have never had this problem. However, I build muscle very easy, and prefer to keep my cardio up to keep a lean look, with out getting too bulky.

For some of us , myself included, I don't always do cardio OR weights on the same day. It depends on the particular rotation I have chosen. Always doing weights and cardio on alternate days works for a while for me, then I have to change. Then I go to a rotation like PS (upper body days with cardio preceding the PS workout) and maybe on day of body max or circuit max.

We have to remember to experiment with what works for us, and make a note of it. And, remember "When it gets too easy" it is really time to change!
Judy

Live by the golden rule: treat others as yourself :)
 
Wow...

Boy... I wish I could see the bodies you guys have. I am pretty happy with my body, but wouldn't mind being more cut than I am. But you guys kill me. I only have the time and energy for one hour workout/day if that. So, I usually alternate weight days and cardio days with a circuit thrown in there sometimes. Once in a while I have time and energy for BodyMax. How do you guys do it? Is there anyone like me that just works out once/day and usually skips a day?

I'm impressed,

Kathy
 
RE: Wow...

I am just like you, Kathy (ksandvoss)! One hour tops! 5 days a week. So I have to wait till the next day to do the "rest" of the workout.

The new workouts fall right in my time slot!!

But I get activity with my job, lots of running around and tough isolation holds (dental hygiene) that keeps me breathing!! and yard work, so it all works out. I rarely sit at the computer or desk except recreationally here!
 
RE: Connie -

If you were my dental hygienist, you'd get a workout like you wouldn't believe - pinning down flailing limbs, keeping the mouth cranked open, and putting me into a half-nelson while the dentist is drilling!

Annette Q. Aquajock
Hailing The Unsung Heroes / Heroines of the Dentists' Office
 
RE: Connie -

I think it would be great if Cathe had time to write a strength training book. If not, maybe a small handbook that we could purchase, there has to be a million questions on this website.
 
RE: Connie -

Tee hee Annette! We do try to make it as comfortable as possible! But there's only so much we can do! Keep brushing and flossing!:D
 
RE: Connie -

Slow in responding here--the idea that strength and cardio training can't be combined is misguided in most cases. The whole concept is taken from looking at two extremes of a fitness continuum. At one end is the power lifter--the person whose goal is to lift the maximum amount of weight in a single repetition. The other end is the marathon runner--the person whose goal is to be able to perform submaximal activity for prolonged periods of time.

To optimize performance at either end of the spectrum, one has to pretty much forgo activity at the other end. But for most of us fitness enthusiasts, we fall right in the middle, meaning that our workout programs can contain both strength and cardio training--even on the same day.

Yes, there are some people who will only optimize muscle mass by keeping the two separate--due to lack of sufficient caloric intake/glycogen depletion. And, I advocate performing strength prior to cardio, both to ensure maximal effort on the resistance portion of the program and to avoid becoming glycogen depleted, since resistance training depends predominantly on anaerobic glycolysis for fueling.

There are also hormonal concerns, but a relatively short cardio session following a resistance training workout won't significantly jeopardize gains in muscularity in the majority of people. There's a big difference in putting in 20-30 minutes of cardio after pumping iron vs lifting followed by a 2 hour run.
Maribeth
 
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