How much carbs and protein should I eat?

W

willpowerAli

Member
I keep on hearing different amounts of carbs that one should eat if they exercise regularly and are trying to lose weight. First, how much daily protein does my body need to recover from the strength training that I do? (I try to work each body part 2x a week....during the next few weeks I will be doing a rotation using S&H).

I bought the Ultimate Workout Log by Suzanne Schlosberg. The section on fueling up states that everyone needs a healthy mix of all three nutrients (forgot to mention fat in subject line). I know there is no one-size-fits-all diet, but I just don't feel like wasting time finding which nutrient balance is best for me. I do 40-40-20, but the book states that most experts agree that getting 40% of your diet from carbs is too low. Later on it has that some people do fine getting 55% of their calories from carbs while others may need 70%. It states that carbs are crucial as a fuel source, particularly for people who exercise regularly. I am wondering if I eat enough carbs. Should I be eating at least 55% of my calories from carbs instead of 40%? The book mentions that if you exercise strenously you need 1.2 to 1.8 grams per kilogram of body weight, depending on how intensily and frequently you work out. It states that 15-20% of the calories should come from protein.

Oh yeah, I never heard this but is it true that within the first 2 hours (sooner is really better for recovery) we should eat 0.5 grams of carbs per pound of body weight. Then eat an additional amount (same amount as before) in the next two hours. It states that we need to replace the carbs depleted from our muscles.

I just can not figure it out. Do we need more protein or more carbs? Any books out there recommended to better understand sports nutrition? Under resources, she listed 3 books.
1. High Performance Nutrition by Susan Kleiner and Maggie Greenwood-Robinson
2. Nancy Clark's Sports Nutrition Guidebook, second edition
3. Nutrition for Women: The Complete Guide by Elizabeth Somer

How can I change my eating program so that I can workout longer and lift more weights so that I can get stronger and leaner? The advice is so conflicting. I may need to read some books (such as those mentioned above for more detailed nutrition information). The Journal does state that we need to experiment with different eating plans and find what works best for us. I like the log because it has room to track how my eating habits affect my workouts. Does the eating plan change when one does a rotation that involves more cardios per week as opposed to if one does less cardio but focuses on strength training?

Alicia
 
Hi Alicia!!

I know this all gets really confusing, especially when you first start reading up on it. But, please, don't overcomplicate it.

Have you heard in some of Maribeth's posts where she says it is simple: calories in, versus calories out?? Well, I think the same simple approach is valuable here. You just need to EAT. Many people get into the thinking that if they just eat in the right proportions, everything will fall into place, and they will look just like Cathe. But there is no secret. Food is nourishment and if you don't get enough you will not grow.

That being said however, I do think it is valuable to read up on when the BEST times for taking in carbs and protein is. Simply, I take this approch. All my meals and snacks include fat, protein and carbs. However, if I just did heavy strength training, I will lean towards a higher percentage protein. If I did a tough cardio workout I will lean towards a higher percentage of carbs and a little less protein. If I am getting ready to do an intense aerobic or anaerobic workout, I always take in some easily digestible sugar source within an hour of working out.

I have tried all patterns of eating, and the only one that I ever noticed a difference with was the low-carb plan. This is just not the plan for me. The rest of the time, I get lots of sleep and put high quality food in my body and I have LOTS of energy.

I guess the more you know the simpler it gets. Get some nutrition texts and read up. You will be glad you did!! Good Luck!!
Janice
 
Janice-RE: How much carbs and protein should I eat?

Thanks for the post. I just want to make sure my body has enough nutrients for recovery and so that I have enough energy for my everyday activities plus working out. Making sure it has everything needed plus losing weight is not easy. I guess with time I will figure out what is best for my body. Working out is important, but results are best seen when the body fat % is reduced. That is why I try to work hard on my eating plan. If I am going to keep on working out consistently, it would be nice to see the muscles I am working. This will motivate me to keep on working hard instead of using the excuse that I could not have a nice strong, muscular body. I will find a reason why I can not have a body in which I see muscle definition and why some women can. Don't get me wrong I am not expecting perfection, that will never happen, but I want to feel that I can achieve a strong body. With time I hope I will see that yes I can have a strong, muscular body. Patience and consistency is what I must have. I will just keep on taking measurements and photos and that will help me see the small changes taking place.

Alicia
 
RE: Janice-RE: How much carbs and protein should I eat?

I can relate to what you are saying. Sadly, I don't think I want the kind of diet you have to have to be "cut". I would love to have the definition Cathe has, but at this point in my life and with a sedentary job, I don't think I could do it. The desk job makes it all the much harder as far as total calories go. The diet that is required to "get ripped" always seems to leave me feeling lethargic and deprived. Maybe I have never found the right one, but when I eat mostly good foods and splurge every so often, I feel the best. But my calories have to be up there. I guess what I think I am saying is that many times the diet that makes you FEEL the best is NOT the diet that makes you LOOK the best. So maybe the question you should be asking is more specifically.. "How do I eat to perform the best" and/or "How do I eat to get "ripped"". At this point in my life I am convinced these are two very different diets.

I did it once. Cut out almost all fat in my diet. Ate nothing but pasta and rice and got "cut" up. Of course I was young, and this diet was in no way healthy, but it got me there. I worked in a gym full time and that was what it was all about. It seemed effortless at the time. Now with my life being about more things than just health and fitness (although I wonder sometimes!!:) it seems much harder to maintain the eating plan. Good Luck to you if you find the diet that works for you. Please, if you ever get ripped, let us know!!!!
 
RE: Janice-RE: How much carbs and protein should I eat?

Just curious, you mentioned there is a diet to "get ripped" and you also mentioned that it involves cutting out fats...is this the key to getting ripped??? Just what kind of diet were you on and is there possibly a balance so you can get somewhat ripped and still feel good (vs.lethargic). And....yes I know there is no magic bullet. I'm on a very strict diet (have to be and it's a long story), but I do eat lot's of nuts for protein (I'm a vegan) and I know I'm probably getting lots of fat from these and wondering if that's keeping me from getting definition. I'm doing weights 3x per week and cardio 3x. Thanks for your comments!!!

Briee
 
RE: Janice-RE: How much carbs and protein should I eat?

Hey Briee..

Though nuts are high in cals, I don't think it is probably hindering your ability to "get ripped", although it may be. If you are eating a high proportion of carbs in addition to these nuts you may be hindering your ability to see definition.

See, this is exactly what I mean. Your diet right now is probably very healthy..full of many good for you fats and good carbs and high quality protein (hopefully!!). When you start the diet needed to see superior muscular definition, you need to significantly lower your calories. This creates a catabolic state in the body which, to me, unless you have alot of fat weight to lose, is going to make you feel crappy. Stay anabolic, and you will perform well and build muscle...but even though you may see muscle gains and some definition, you will not be ripped.

Maribeth talks in another thread about fitness models and something about their diets before competition. They are crazy! Not good for you..but they will produce the results many of us seek.

Getting "ripped" in a short period of time takes a drastic cut in calories. You can attain more definition by doing it what I think is the RIGHT way, which is VERY slightly reducing calories..paying close attention that you are still building muscle. Then, increase your overall activity level. Again, pay attention that you are still building muscle. If you see that you are not changing much, I would up the calories. This kind of diet will produce definition, but it will take longer to get to the point where you have LOTS of lean mass and much lower fat. The idea is to trick your body so that it does not think it is starving. If you are strength training the BIGGEST mistake is not taking in enough calories!!!

Because this is so hard, and because usually bodybuilders have a very set amount of time in which they need to get "ripped" they bulk up, THEN lean down. Any drastic changes to diet or exercise will either force your body to be catabolic or anabolic depending on what you are feeding it. During the "bulking" stage, bodybuilders stay anabolic eating lots of protein and carbs with moderate fat. Then, once a sufficient amount of muscle has been built, they lean down. They sharply cut calories, keeping protein high, carbs too low to really feel good, and fat almost non existent. This is how they get "ripped". Inevitably, in this process of leaning out, some muscle is lost in the process. They have gone catabolic.

Of course, they pay very close attention, as they do not want to lose a high percentage of muscle mass, but pretty much they gotta do whatever it takes to win.

When I do a rotation concentrating on muscle building, my diet changes. I eat more and don't feel as guilty about it. I am looking to stay anabolic. I eat more protein..and more carbs. When I do a rotation to lean out, I SLIGHTLY bring my calories down, cut out empty calories, but still eat healthy fats. Although I am not as "cut" as Cathe, I am close.


The diet I had when I was younger was VERY freakish. I NEVER touched cheese. I NEVER ate any oil. I was stupid and lacked the knowlege I have today. My skin was dry. My hair was falling out, and I stopped menstruating. I looked "wasted". After being around many fitness type poeple when I worked in a gym for so many years, you get a feel for how wasted looks. It is like looking at muscles that are begging to be fed. My sister is this way. She works out, lifts weights, does cardio, but her lean mass has withered away from sharply cutting calories and increasing cardio. She lacks "the pump" of a healthy, well fed muscle. This is what I was doing. Sure, people asked me all the time what my routine was cuz I looked so "cut", but I would NEVER advocate that to someone else now. Besides, back then, I never picked up a weight. My routine is much more balanced now as is my diet. Although I am healthier now, the comments do not flow as much as they used to.

Jeez, sorry this is so long...I can go on and on!! But I say, start slightly reducing your cals and do it that way like I said. This IS the best way. If you are too impatient, feel free to "bulk" up and then "lean down" but I do not advise trying to sharply cut cals because you are impatient and then packing on the cardio while you are still lifting heavy. You will be working against yourself!!! And remember, there are changes happening in your body if you are exercising intensly, sometimes it is just hard to see that!! Good Luck, and let me know.......Janice
 
RE: Janice-RE: How much carbs and protein should I eat?

Fascinating Stuff!!!!! I don't mind you going on and on. Thanks so much, I'm going to try some of this, not the extreme wasting diet. Just cutting calories slightly. I don't have much fat to lose. Although I had a baby four months ago, I worked out HEAVILY through my pregnancy. Primarily lifting. Gained probably 35 pounds and was back to 103 lbs (I'm 5'2 and a half) 2 months post preg. This was baby number 5, the first four babies I gained 60 pounds and it took 1 1/2 years to get close to 110. I'm finally gaining some muscle but would like it to look a little more defined, I'm not looking for a major ripped appearance. I just ordered all the tapes necessary for the tank top rotation. Any more suggestions??

Briee
 
RE: Janice-RE: How much carbs and protein should I eat?

Hey...

You leave me in the dust!!! On baby number five!! Girl, I don't think you have much to worry about, sounds like you are doing a pretty good job of maintaining your figure. Maybe I should be asking YOU for pointers. I have had no kids yet, so I still have it pretty easy. Good for you that you have been able to keep it up exercising. God knows how you find the time!! If I think of anything else, I will post. Talk to you later...Janice
 
RE: Janice-RE: How much carbs and protein should I eat?

NaughtOJ,

Will tell you if I ever find the "diet" that gets me the body I want. Yeah, I need one that I can keep on doing for a long time. I think I need more carbs because that is what I need to perform. I am still looking for something I can handle. I was looking at a paper my doctor gave me in May with an eating plan for 1500 calories. The paper also has 1000 and 1200 calories (I think that is correct, but he told me to follow the 1500 calorie one). That helped me with my loss back then. I noticed it has 214 g of carbs, 62 g of protein, and 44 g of fat. Maybe I should start that one again. That would be about 57% carbs, 17% protein, and 26% fat. Maybe I should bring up protein % up a bit more and bring down fat %. I'll think about it. I do want to eat to perform my best.

Alicia
 
RE: Janice-RE: How much carbs and protein should I eat?

Janice,

So it seems like women bodybuilders go through two phases. One is they focus on gaining muscle mass and then the other phase is lowering body fat (and losing a bit of the muscle as well). Is this correct? I just had a woman body builder send me an e-mail, but she told me about working out not the nutrition aspect. Here is her e-mail to me:

Alicia, wow girl you are on the ball!! Okay, I think doing the slow and heavy work is great. But here is my question to you exactly what is your goal. If your goal is to gain muscle mass and strength, then you must train with heavy weight and do low reps. The key to growth and strength is to stimulate the muscle as much as possible followed by 5-7 days of rest. Now if you are trying to get lean and your main target is bodyfat then you need to train with lighter weight and higher reps. This type of training is more cardiovascular, therefore you will burn more calories. The reason some people do interval training is to get the benefits of both. If this is your goal then, I suggest you train for 6 weeks heavy--low reps. Then switch to your low weight high rep training for 6 weeks. If you are working towards a goal date that is within 12 weeks than break it down to 4 and 4 or 5 and 5. Either way you want to split your training down the middle. *Do not do 3 and 3. It will not be enough time for you to reach optimal results.

One thing to always remember is fat does not turn into muscle or vice versa. This theory is completely fiction. When choosing a training program prioritze your goals. It is impossible to try to gain muscle and burn fat at the same time. Through mere exercise. Diet and supplementation play a huge role. But for the most part, people who say they gain muscle and lose fat are simply losing fat and water around the muscle, therefore their muscles appear bigger, fuller and defined.
I hope I answered all your questions. I always seem to go off on a tangent! Marina




Alicia
 
Alicia..
Thanks for posting the email from your friend. I would agree with her. She seems very knowlegeable and I would heed her advice. I also would up the protein by atleast 30 or 40 grams per day on your prospective diet, especially if you decide to go "slow and heavy". The rest all seems good. Good Luck to you!!!
 
Janice,
I asked her about nutrition and cardio and this is what she responded:

Alicia, I truly enjoy getting mail from women who are self motivated and
are seeking results. First off, yes I was overweight as a teenager. Between
the ages of 15 and 18 I weighed about 155-160 lbs. It wasn't until my
freshmen year of college that I began reading more about proper nutrition and
exercise. Since then I have been able to maintain a healthy physique.
Moving on, while on your muscle gaining training i suggest you do cardio.
Begin with 3-4 sessions a week each session should be 30 mins. I believe in
interval training. Do 2-3 mins of low impact cardio and 2-3 mins of intense
cardio. For example: alternate a brisk walk and jog. You can do this type
of interval training with any cardio machine (bike, EFX, stairmaster,etc.)
Every 2 weeks increase your sessions by 15 mins. or just add an additional
session. Continue to do this into your ripped down training. By the 3rd
week into your second phase you should be doing cardio twice a day 4-5 times
a week. Never do cardio for more than 60 mins! Anymore than an hour and
your tearing away muscle!
As far as eating your protein should be between 30-35 grams per meal during
the first 6weeks. Then drop it down to 20-25 grams the last 6 weeks. Your
carbs should be around 30-35 grams for 4 meals and 2 meals your carbs should
be up to 40-45 grams (preferably after your workout and and your first meal.)
Then drop them on the 6 weeks to 20-25 grams per meal. And if you have
stubborn fat drop your carbs 3 weeks after. But just keep in touch with me
and I can help you. Your fat should come from CLA or EFA caps and naturally
occuring fats found in meats. Eat red meat twice a week during your first
phase (lean cuts)--nothing with alot of marbling. Okay I think I answered
most of your questions. Like I said email me whenever. My husband and I own
3 nutrition stores and a supplemetn company, so i live and breathe this
stuff. I don't not mind at all helping anyone out!!!! I am currently
working on my website it should be up by the end of September! i'll keep you
posted!

Thanks,
Marina


Alicia
 
Man, doesn't it seem like we shouldn't have to work so HARD??!!! Jeez, it is all so complicated! Thanks for the info and keep me updated on the progress. If you manage to handle five kids and maintain a bodybuilder schedule, you WILL be my idol!! Move over Cathe......
 
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