What's so bad about dairy?

I don't see anywhere in the reports any proven connection of the raw milk and paralysis. The reports say that the man suffers from Guillain-Barre syndrome. However, studies show that in 60 % of the cases the cause for Guillain-Barre is an influenza virus, it can also be induced by vaccines and the bacteria Campylobacter.

I am not saying that it is impossible that he got it through the raw milk. We can get sick by all kinds of "regular" foods, including pasteurized milk, contaminated spinach, peanuts, chicken, paralysis due shellfish consumption.......It's not a problem of the product itself but in most cases unsafe handling.

That being said, I am really not following the reasoning, one person - ONE, gets sick and it is possibly linked to raw milk and that makes the product unsafe in general. How scientific is that? I don't see any drugs or other products touted unsafe all over tv and media because one person gets sick. In fact, thousands of people die every year from properly dispensed prescription meds, thousands of people get sick from food poisoning every year and thousands of people had Guillain Barre induced by FDA approved "safe" vaccines. In 2006 1,600 prisoners contracted campylobacter from pasteurized milk in California, in 2007 4 people in Massachussettes died from complications from listeriosis contracted from pasteurized milk ......

I try to avoid milk and milk products where possible for myself. My kids still consume some milk and milk products but it is organic and raw (when available).
 
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hiitdogs said:
I am not saying that it is impossible that he got it through the raw milk. We can get sick by all kinds of "regular" foods, including pasteurized milk, contaminated spinach, peanuts, chicken, paralysis due shellfish consumption.......It's not a problem of the product itself but in most cases unsafe handling.
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Mishandling is the most obvious answer to me, if milk is where he got the G-B syndrome. It can also be caused by the flu and flu vaccinations, and I wonder if he got either around the same time - he is in the age group the vaccination is most recommended for.

Melissa
 
One more reason to love Trader Joe's

.....as if we really needed one!

You can get a variety of raw cheeses there. Now, I didn't see too many that were both raw AND organic but.....raw cheddar for $5 a pound is better than the boutique health food store for sure.
 
OK I have a question...what is the difference between organic dairy and raw dairy? Is it ok to get organic if you can't find raw? And does Trader Joe's have organic milk? I'd rather throw my money at them than Whole Foods lol.

The more I learn, the more confused I get!
 
Hi Melissa. Organic foods are processed without the use of pesticides, hormones, and other artificial yuk. So, organic milk and dairy would be from cows that weren't treated with chemicals and the milk itself isn't treated with chemicals.

Raw refers to pasteurization - where they heat the milk to high temperatures to kill bacteria (and also any potentially healthful enzymes, etc.). Raw milk is just that - it hasn't been cooked. It still has it's active enzymes.

And yes, I'm sure Trader Joe's has organic milk. But it is pasteurized. It is quite difficult to find raw milk per se but easier to find raw cheese.

Hope this helps!
 
Thanks Suzanne! That def does help. I'm going to check TJ's and if need be, I guess I will hit up WF and check out their selection.
 
meliffy18 said:
OK I have a question...what is the difference between organic dairy and raw dairy? Is it ok to get organic if you can't find raw? And does Trader Joe's have organic milk? I'd rather throw my money at them than Whole Foods lol.

The more I learn, the more confused I get!
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It's enough to make your head spin!

Raw aged cheeses are relatively easy to find in better grocery stores because the laws around them are looser than those for fresh dairy products (milk, yogurt, butter).

Raw means unpasteurized and not homogenized. The ultimate is grass-fed raw.

I'm skeptical of the "organic" label and how it's pretty much been bastardized. Personally, I would go for a locally produced milk or other dairy product over a national brand organic. You might be able to find pasteurized, but not homogenized, which would be the next best thing.

Depending on what state you live in, you may only be able to get raw milk directly from the farmer...that's how it is in my state, and while it's not the most convenient method, it gives you the chance to see where and how the cows are living...know your food, so to speak. The Weston Price Foundation has a listing of raw milk sources by state, if you decide to that route: http://www.realmilk.com/where.html

How did food become so complicated? :confused:
 
Sorry about all the questions!!!

So I love my Greek yogurt as a mid-morning snack. I was reading the package and even though it has pasteurized milk in it, it says "no synthetic growth hormones." Do you think it's still ok to eat or could it have other stuff in there that's questionable in regard to dairy??
 
meliffy18 said:
Sorry about all the questions!!!

So I love my Greek yogurt as a mid-morning snack. I was reading the package and even though it has pasteurized milk in it, it says "no synthetic growth hormones." Do you think it's still ok to eat or could it have other stuff in there that's questionable in regard to dairy??
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Weeellllll...that's a whole different story there. The controversy surrounding industrial dairy has made me really question how much I want to eat of it (none, actually, recently).

You'll have to decide for yourself what's important and look at what you eat and why you eat it.

I've toyed for years with the idea of giving up dairy. I always felt it was at the root of some of my minor health afflictions. But it was really, really, really hard to give up. So I didn't.

Lately I've gotten up the nerve to try again - and it's not so bad.

So, if you are concerned about chemicals only, you might be ok finding an organic brand. If you're concerned about the dairy industry...you might want to think deeper. And if you're concerned about dairy products as a food choice...there again...you'll want to do some reading and research and then decide for yourself.

Probably that's not so helpful! :p
 
Hi all, I'm pretty new to these forums. I appreciate the thoughtful and open-minded discussion about dairy in this thread. What a nice bunch of people!

Anyway, just thought I'd throw my 2 cents in. I've been dairy-free for several years, despite loving (LOVING!) milk and cheese for decades, because I discovered by happy accident that my seasonal allergies are 90% better when I don't consume dairy.

I thought that life without dairy would be bleak, but there are so many non-dairy alternatives that it turned out to be no big deal. Daiya cheese is awesome and dairy-free. Coconut milk, almond milk, soy milk, oat milk, hemp milk, and so on... I had to find the ones I like, everyone's taste is different. "The Joy of Vegan Baking" made me realize that dairy-free desserts are a cinch.

Anyway, count me as one of those dairy-lovers who never thought she'd give it up, but my health is so much better without it. (Also, it's better for the environment to be dairy-free!)
 
Bobbi-B said:
I discovered by happy accident that my seasonal allergies are 90% better when I don't consume dairy.
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My allergies are much better as well (and that's a good thing, as one of the things I'm allergic to is cats...and I have 4 and visit dozens at my shelter!).

I've spoken with several people, including Dr. Neal Barnard, who have anecdotal evidence that eliminating dairy products reduces the severity of allergies (no actual studies have been done that I know of).

My theory is that most people are somewhat sensitive to the proteins in dairy, but it usually doesn't show up as an allergy to dairy or lactose intolerance. But consuming dairy can kind of push the body over the edge of its tolerance and make other allergies manifest more strongly.
 
Ok so I have another question (sorry!!!). I remember reading somewhere that when it comes to milk products, packaging that says no hormones, no antibiotics, and no pesticides is really negligible, since all milk will contain a trace of hormones and pesticides/antibiotics aren't used in any dairy, even if it isn't organic. I was looking on the Organic Consumers Assoc online and found a farm that ships dairy to my area but it states all of the 3 above as a selling point for its milk. Also, on the dairy page, it condones Stoneyfield as a good place to get yogurt. Last I checked Stoneyfield isn't a local farm. Here is the website: http://www.hudsonmilk.com/products.html

I want to order some fresh milk but I don't even know how to tell if this is legit or not?
 
kathryn said:
My allergies are much better as well (and that's a good thing, as one of the things I'm allergic to is cats...and I have 4 and visit dozens at my shelter!).

I've spoken with several people, including Dr. Neal Barnard, who have anecdotal evidence that eliminating dairy products reduces the severity of allergies (no actual studies have been done that I know of).

My theory is that most people are somewhat sensitive to the proteins in dairy, but it usually doesn't show up as an allergy to dairy or lactose intolerance. But consuming dairy can kind of push the body over the edge of its tolerance and make other allergies manifest more strongly.
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That's my theory too! :) I'm not aware of any research on it, either. The dairy industry certainly isn't going to fund any research like that, but a good NIH study would be welcome.
 
meliffy18 said:
Ok so I have another question (sorry!!!). I remember reading somewhere that when it comes to milk products, packaging that says no hormones, no antibiotics, and no pesticides is really negligible, since all milk will contain a trace of hormones and pesticides/antibiotics aren't used in any dairy, even if it isn't organic. I was looking on the Organic Consumers Assoc online and found a farm that ships dairy to my area but it states all of the 3 above as a selling point for its milk. Also, on the dairy page, it condones Stoneyfield as a good place to get yogurt. Last I checked Stoneyfield isn't a local farm. Here is the website: http://www.hudsonmilk.com/products.html

I want to order some fresh milk but I don't even know how to tell if this is legit or not?
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Where did you find that pesticides/antibiotics are not used in any dairy? Per regulations of the FDA pesticides and antibiotics can't be ""added" to the milk / dairy product but antibiotics can be and are adminstered to the cattle and pesticides are usually in the feed in non-organic operations.

It is true that all milk will contain hormones just by the mere fact that milk contains the hormones of pregnant/lactating cows as well as IGF-1 (a growth hormone) that is naturally in milk. It will however be multiplied exponentially if additional antibiotics and hormones are administered to the cows (as is the case with most of the dairy operations). Pesticides that are ingested (through food or external exposure) by breastfeeding mothers are passed on to their babies through the breastmilk, the same is valid for cows.

As to the website. That's really cute! They are not adding artificial hormones? Well, there are also "natural" hormones :eek: It bears the question - are they not adding ANY hormones? Or are they just not adding artificial hormones?
BST is a hormone that is present in all lactating cows. BST/bGH as a "natural" hormone has been added in many dairy operations to increase milk production in cows before Monsanto synthesised that hormone which is now sold as Posilac (= rBST or rBGH). It is used because it is cheaper than the "natural" form and yield a better result (= higher milk production).

Maybe this website will give you a better explanation. http://www.sustainabletable.org/issues/hormones/
 
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kariev said:
this is a very interesting discussion. i've been having body breakouts (primarily on my upper arms) I've been reading how dairy can cause skin breakouts. Anyone have any experience with clearing up their skin by giving up dairy? My diet is rich in whole clean foods so its not like i'm eating tons of stuff that isn't good for my skin.
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I have been "off" of dairy for nearly 4 years...I know longer have acne (within 2 weeks "off" was cleared up), and no longer have a chronic drippy nose...Don't have that constant mucus in my throat...LOVE the clear life!

MJ in MN
 
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