Educated dog owners/vets - Hip dysplasia ?

dreamyjeanie

Cathlete
Since we have so many educated dog people, I thought I'd ask if anyone has had any experience with Hip Dysplasia in a young dog? Treatments, advice, what questions to ack etc.

We just found out today that Summer, our golden retriever puppy has it. We have an appointment with an orthopedic surgeon tomorrow, but I was just trying to find out about other people's experiences.

Jean
 
My parents' Rottweiler had it, and the vet prescribed Glycoflex to help maintain the joints. As far as I know, surgery was never discussed.

Be careful. A vet "diagnosed" my German Shepherd with it, and half a dozen other things because she was in pain, and the vet was dead wrong. She was having pain because she had an advanced tick-borne disease (don't ask me how to spell it, but it's pronounced Irlikiosis). I found that out by going to another vet, and by then, it was too late. We had to put her to sleep.
 
Oh, that's too bad! Poor Miss Sunshine!

I know of a trailing dog who has had hip dysplasia since she was about a year old. They have managed to keep it in check with vet issued glucosamine (sp)(Probably the GlycoFlex mentioned above) and anti-inflammatories for when the pain gets bad. I've taken her on 11 mile trail runs, and she's fine. The symptoms first appeared when she would get upset at the dog park when other dogs ran towards her. She even snapped at her best friend, my older Aussie, once. I do know there are surgical options. I think it depends on how far it's progressed and how bad it is over all. I do agree with getting a second opinion, especially if surgery is necessary - there are some great new techniques out that can save pain on Sunny's side, and worry on yours.
 
Jean,

sorry to hear about Sunshine's problems. I saw this a while ago and wanted to respond but got sidetracked.

I have quite a bit of experience with hip dysplasia in young dogs. I got my boy, Tuxedo when he was 10 months old, he was and is the picture of THE perfect Mini Aussie, the head, the structure, temperament, BUT he had hip dysplasia which was the reason why the breeder took him out of the breeding program. Now, this was a $ 3,000 dog that I got for almost nothing. But the breeder told me that she was pretty certain that he had hip problems. Having gone through the problems with a previous dog, I knew exactly what I was getting myself into. There was a clear movement in Tuxedo's hip when he walked, any exercise over 5 minutes there was a very pronounced limp on the leg that that was effected. I talked to two vets, one said my one and only option was hip replacement surgery, the other one (which is my current vet) said, let’s wait and see, light exercise to develop his muscles around there but she was very clear, “It’s bad!!!”. I was determined that my dog would beat the odds.

I fed him a home made diet of grains (brown rice, bulgur, quinoa, amaranth, couscous, multigrains …..) with ground (almost raw) meats, ground bones, ground organ meat, some veggies, probiotics, kelp, lecithin, brewer’s yeast, essential oils ( I used Halo’s Dream Coat or Grizzly Salmon Oil, sometimes butter or safflower oil) calcium (from dried and ground eggshells or human grade bonemeal), he also got cottage cheese or yogurt (either mixed into the food or straight). Every second day I would feed raw meats like chicken drumsticks, chicken wings, chicken necks, turkey necks, lamb necks, beef rack, lamb meaty bones ……. Canned salmon with bones mixed with rice once or twice a week, grated and blanched veggies (until I found Dr. Harvey’s Veg-to-Bowl freeze dried veggies – LOVE that stuff).

I added very high amounts of vitamin C (Halo Xtra C or Berte’s Naturals Vitamin C), when they said ½ tsp, I gave twice or triple the amount. I added a Glucosamine/Chondroitin supplements on a daily basis (GlycoFlex from VetriScience, got it though www.kvvet.com).


I listened to my vet and started to slowly increase the exercise, took him for 20 minute walks, took him to the dog park. Every time he would limp, and I kept thinking, oh my God, am I doing the right thing? I am hurting my dog! But I kept with it, a couple of months later I enrolled him in Agility Training, the breeder said, you ARE nuts, my vet said, it’s too much, too soon. I ignored what they said because I thought it is the right thing to do.

I picked up Tuxedo on August 19, 2006 for my younger son’s birthday, fast forward, end of September 2007 I took Tuxedo for his yearly check up to my vet. Her chin dropped, literally, she said, if I didn’t know better, I’d say this is NOT the same dog! I took him to a clinic in Chino Valley on October 5, together with 18 other dogs of 4 different breeders that are affiliated with the breeder that I bought my Mini Aussies from. The breeder that I bought Tuxedo from wanted to get his x-rays done, so she could go back to the breeder that she bought him from for a LOT of money and she needed to prove that there was indeed a problem.

The vet there took the x-rays, when I came in to get it interpreted, she told me, looking at the x-rays, that this was one of the worst x-rays she had seen in a long time, there was SEVERE hip dysplasia, even I as a novice with no clue could see the severe problem. Just based on the x-rays he shouldn’t even be walking and have hip replacement surgery done NOW. Looking at the x-rays and at him, however, there was a real disconnect. The vet in Chino Valley said that she would have never guessed that he was a dog with that severe of a hip dysplasia case, in fact she wouldn’t have ever thought there was a problem. She did take him around outside the clinic, watching his stride and movement and said this was nothing short of amazing, whatever I am doing I should keep doing, and asked me to write down for her what exactly I had been doing.

Tuxedo is a dog with SEVERE hip dysplasia according to his x-rays and he leaps up 3 to 5 feet in the air to catch a ball or a frisbee. He doesn’t limp anymore, I can take him for 2 or 3 hour hikes now, no problems. He doesn’t seem to be in any pain, he is not on any pain killers and he beats out his buddies who have excellent hip scores by the length of a nose or two EVERY single time. He is nothing short of a miracle according to the vets that have seen him.


Now, this was a novel, what I am trying to say, don’t get discouraged, EXTREME hip dysplasia is not a death sentence, it doesn’t necessarily mean it’s hip replacement surgery or expensive treatment. Obviously, there are no guarantees and every dog is different but there are things you can do quite inexpensively to help your dog and give her a normal life. She will always have hip dysplasia, just like my little boy, Tuxedo, it’s non-reversible, there is no cure. But dogs are able to live a normal, pain-free and happy life, even with severe hip dysplasia, my little boy is living proof of that.

So before I shut up, here are the links for the supplements that I have used:

Vitamin C http://www.mysimon.com/9015-10992_8-29595309.html http://www.b-naturals.com/product_info.php?products_id=81

Kelp http://www.kvvet.com/KVVet/product_...alse&mscssid=D9B7C084CBC14E0BBB8AC9ED4DDE6646

Lecithin The cheapest I have found is www.vitaminshoppe.com

They also carry Halo, check for sales as well as human grade bonemeal (if you don’t want to go through the hassle of drying and grinding egg shells)

Brewer’s Yeast www.vitaminshoppe.com

Oils http://www.google.com/products?sour...C,SNYC:2004-13,SNYC:en&q=halo+dream+coat&um=1 again, check the Vitaminshoppe

http://www.amazon.com/Grizzly-All-N...1?ie=UTF8&s=home-garden&qid=1196142054&sr=1-1

Probiotics http://www.b-naturals.com/product_info.php?products_id=84

On the meat, I either buy at Whole Foods, Frye’s, Safeway, wherever I find what I am looking for, otherwise look for Nature’s Logic, Bravo Raw Diet or Oma’s Pride. I will just mix it with the grains or veggies I have on hand. I feed green tripe at least once a week, sometimes I get Bravo frozen veggies or frozen pumpkin which is great when dogs have diarrhea or constipation

I use fresh grated and blanched veggies (kale, lettuce, broccoli, carrots, peas), if time is an issue check http://www.sitstay.com/dog/supplies/servlet/product_10001_10001_61941_-1_Veg-to-Bowl___ or frozen veggies from Bravo.

The only other advise I can give you, whatever vet you have, DO NOT let them talk you into giving your dog Rimaldyn, this is a drug that is routinely prescribed by many vets for dogs with hip dysplasia, however, there have been numerous reports that Labradors have serious problems with that drug. Labs seem to have a problem metabolizing the ingredient in the drug and it can be fatal.


I know there are some naturopathic and homeopathic remedies that have worked well for a lot of people, but try this first, you can always add. Also check out Dr. Richard Pitcairn's Complete Guide for Natural Health for Cats and Dogs. Great Book!

I can’t think of anything else right now, but I am sure this was a lot of information anyway. However, feel free to email me if you have any questions or need further information. I am not a pet nutritionist, nor am I a vet. Just my own experience and the advise that I have gotten from my college roommate who has been a naturopathic vet in Germany for the past 10 years.
 
I think you really have make CERTAIN that that is the problem.. and not ligament tears or SPINAL or LOWER BACK issues.
It drives me nuts when people used to constantly ask me about our German Shepherd and his hips.. it was a HUGE problem for them in the 70's and they have done a good job at more or less breeding it out of their genetics (for that breed). Our dog had a disease (NOW common in GS's) that effected the spine, making it stick out and creating some arthritis.
Do NOT over feed the dog, older dogs especially. I have never been a fan of feeding house animals people food for many reasons, but get as many opinions from vets as you can about the diagnosis.
Good luck
 
Thanks, MadnNatsMom! I am happy that it turned out well for Tuxedo. I think though that I am the lucky one. He is a great boy and the best dog anyone could wish for.

As to the post that hip dysplasia has been bred out of the genetics of GS or any other breed, this is not entirely accurate. HD cannot be "bred out". You can have two dogs with excellent hip scores and still get a puppy with moderate to severe HD. On the other hand you can have two parents with moderate to severe HD and get a puppy with good to excellent hip scores. A responsible breeder will ALWAYS eliminate dogs with questionable hip scores, many of the not so reputable breeders don't even do those OFAs though, however, two dogs with marginal or bad hip scores don't necessarily reproduce only puppies with HD.

Whereas one of the factors for HD is hereditary/genetics, it is now believed that environmental factors play a HUGE role and that HD can be if not avoided but at least controlled with adequate exercise, nutrition and supplements.

I am not sure what "people food" refers to. If people food means human grade meat, grains and wholesome ingredients that I know where they come from, prepared to meet the nutritional requirements of a dog or cat, yeah I am feeding my dogs "people food". Complete and balanced nutrition can be achieved maybe not on a daily basis but over time, realistically you cannot feed complete and balanced nutrition with every meal without the addition of artificial vitamins and ingredients, no matter if it is for pets or humans. If people food means table scraps, donuts, McD, etc, no, that's not what I feed my dogs or what I would advise to feed a dog.

I sometimes can't help but chuckle at how much the pet food industry has brainwashed us (and even vets) with their marketing and their claim of complete and balanced diet. I guess we can feed our children but we are incapable of feeding our dogs and cats a adequate or balanced diet. I guess feeding pets is more rocket science than feeding a human being. If we don't buy commercial pet foods we are bad pet parents.

In a nutshell, they are putting into pet food what is called 3Ds, diseased, disabled and drugged. Those parts not fit for human consumption (cancerous materials, injection sites, etc), are treated with chemicals and forwarded to a rendering plant. There this stuff will be mixed with euthanized dogs, other pets or zoo animals containing phenobaribtol from the euthanizing drug, add some ethoxquin (as 3/4 of the commercial pet food companies do) as a preservative to keep the fat from going rancid (ethoxqin originally is a rubber stabilizer for tires), add some rancid grains not fit for human consumption, add some artificial food dyes, hormones and process this at high heat to "sterilize" and add some synthetic vitamins, and voila you have "complete and balanced nutrition" for your pet. Do some research on what is going into your pets food, it is far from the whole grain and healthy cuts of meat that is shown on every package of pet food.

Smelled some of the commercial dog/cat foods at the supermarket lately? If you were aware what is in there, you wouldn't stick you hand in it, let alone feed man's best friend to eat it. With the wholesale and delivery process the kibble can be stuck in a warehouse for 12 to 18 months, but hey, got enough preservatives in it that it doesn't matter. I sure would love to eat that, I am sure it's really healthy complete and balanced nutrition, much better than "people food".

The way the industry requirements works I can take a bunch of old leather shoes with some peanut hulls, add some sythetic vitamins and have "balanced and complete nutrition".

Even if ALL of that had no merit, just imagine someone would come up and say they have found the perfect food for us humans. It contains all proteins, carbs, fats and all essential vitamins, processed at high heat but all essential vitamins added. Just put it in a bowl and feed it to our kids day in, day out, breakfast, lunch and dinner. For variety, add some milk, gravy, bake it, microwave it etc, kind of like feeding Total cereal to our kids, every day, it's got 100% of the essential vitamins, doesn't it? None would even think about it, right? What's different????

Sorry, this REALLY is one of my pet peeves (no pun intended :) ), I wish more people would do research on what they actually put in their pets mouth before talking about the drawbacks of "people food for pets". I get very passionate about this, and I am sorry if I rattle some cages or sound condenscending. Whatever you guys do, I am sure you want to do the best for your furry friends, but don't just dismiss "people food" for dogs without research.

Off my soapbox now. http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/4/4_2_205.gif
 
Thank you everyone for your responses. Trying to figure out the right thing for our baby is so hard especially after losing Sunshine in August, I want to make sure I do everything I can to make sure Summer has a great life, so I appreciate all the opinions and information shared here.

Carola, your story is amazing. I didn't realize the mini aussies were even one of the breeds that HD was common in. I know how common it is with the larger breeds. I'm so glad you shared your story. Thanks for all the info. Now its time for me to do some more research from what everyone has shared and try to make the best decision for Summer.

Jean
 

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