Delusion, or right where I need to be?

[hiitdogs]

I agree with everyone else, it sounds like an awful lot of workouts.

I was just reading Thrive by Brandan Brazier last night and he talks about rest periods being as important if not more than the exercise itself. He also talks about stress that is being put on the body by not fueling the workouts with the right food, too few calories and exercising too much which in turn will produce cortisol and make the body hold on to its fat reserves. I haven't read the whole book yet.

I admire your stamina but I think you may be a little too hard on your body.

 

[bonvivant]

I would like to lose 20lbs of body fat, maintain muscle, and not have to eat a low-calorie diet to do it.

To achieve all that, rest is especially necessary. Are you training for something other than life? If that's the case, keep training until your event while taking a rest day or two each week. If this is what you do to lose body fat, take a week (or two) off then slowly bring back some of those intense workouts. Or take it down a notch for a little while then bring back the intensity while keeping the lower intensity workouts. Variable intensity can be good for fat loss. You can go for a stroll instead of a power walk or walking intervals. Try some high rep training for variety. Variable intensity is great for losing fat.

You need to remember that rest is just as important as exercise. That's when your body repairs and gets you ready for the next workout. The symptoms you posted are classic signs of overtraining. Your body will refuse to drop fat (and will likely eat muscle as fat is tenacious) and keep you spinning your wheels. Good luck to you. Again, please rest!

 

[morningstar]

Okayyyyyyyy!!!!!!!!!!! I get it, I get it! The general consensus seems to be that I am a overtraining fool. I spent a lot of time thinking today about how I can change things up, and here's what I came up with:

Monday:

• sprint run intervals (30 minutes, plus 10 minutes warm up, 10 minutes cool down and 20 minutes stretch)
• 50 minute regular walk (home from work)

Tuesday:

• sprint run intervals (30 minutes, plus 10 minutes warm up, 10 minutes cool down and 20 minutes stretch)
• 50 minute regular walk (home from work)
• Strength/circuit training (60 minutes)

Wednesday (rest day):

• 50 minute regular walk (to work)
• 50 minute regular walk (home from work)

Thursday:

• sprint run intervals (30 minutes, plus 10 minutes warm up, 10 minutes cool down and 20 minutes stretch)
• 50 minute regular walk (home from work)
• Strength/circuit training (60 minutes)

Friday:

• sprint run intervals (30 minutes, plus 10 minutes warm up, 10 minutes cool down and 20 minutes stretch)
• 50 minute regular walk (home from work)

Saturday:

• Strength/circuit training (60 minutes)

Sunday:

• Cathe Cardio (step, kickboxing, etc.) (60 minutes)

Before you jump all over me about the walking, I don't have a car or a bike and I don't take transit. I walk everywhere. I generally run sprints to get to work, and walk home. The above rotation is significantly less than I do now, as the workouts are half as long as I usually do, I gave myself a rest day, and included a Cathe cardio day.

Thank you to all of you for taking the time and energy to respond- sometimes vehemently! It really is very appreciated and I was paying attention- I promise! I just love to work out, and I keep adding and adding and adding and adding.... Hey, I used to do 3-6 hour workouts every single day- my rotation nowadays was actually meant to be a less intense rotation to avoid overtraining!

 

[dreamyjeanie]

I was wondering if there is a reason why you do sprint intervals 2 days in a row. I have heard that one should alternate sprint days with steady state, but I can't find any info to support it. Does anyone know if one is better than the other? I know to improve speed, intervals help, but I don't know how many times per week they are recommended.

Jean

 

[morningstar]

I just hate state state running. I would rather do sprint intervals any day- I really love them.

 

[maddiesmum]

I still think this is too much. You should think about cutting out the Tues and Thurs sprint intervals. You do not need them for cardiovascular conditioning, you already have enough. Make these days all about weight training, plus your walk home from work. Trust me: this really is enough.

Back to back sprint intervals on Monday and Tuesday is not a good idea.

The last word is, of course, yours, but I thought you wanted results and to be free from nagging injuries and illness?

Seriously: over the past year I have lost 10 pounds without trying. I don't work out more, I work out smarter. Some weeks have me taking 3 rest days because that's just how I feel, and yet, I am running further and harder, faster than before, without the injury I suffered last year, and my lower body strength is excellent. You really don't have to nearly kill yourself to be fit and feel good.

Clare

 

[Worknprogress]

Morningstar - I really think you should consult a trainer on this issue. It has been my experience and reading things and working with trainers that you should never do one thing over and over and over.

I know you just posted a revised workout but it seems that you are repeating similar workouts through the week, just less time (the interval running).

From the two workout schedules you posted it appears you really like interval training but you tend to make too many of your workouts during the week exactly the same. For instance, even though you are doing power walking versus running, it still propels your legs in only the forward direction instead of mixing it up with kickboxing or step that works your legs sideways and upwards).

As a runner, I do not have 2 of my running workoutsthe same in one given week. I know you said that steady state is boring but get your IPod going with some really cool music and since you already do hour long intervals with an additional 50 minutes of walking, I would suggest your steady state run to be 90 minutes ONCE a week for endurance purposes and the rest of your aerobic training should vary greatly.

I would then do some interval training like you are already doing but as a previous poster suggested - do some HIIT training only twice a week. I incorporate TRUE HIIT training 3 months ago and although it is so intense that I can barely do the 20 minutes - it has improved my aerobic/VO2 dramatically.

But you also stated that you still had some unwanted pounds but you are working out hours and hours more than you need to be. I think those pounds are still hanging on because your body has become "used to" your workouts and you probably are not getting the benefits out of them you want to get. Again, I would love a fitness trainer to chime in here because that seems to be the info I get from mine.

I guess the bottom line I learned from reading and trainers is: you never do the same workout more than twice a week or your body gets used to it and your workout regiment should be so "un"regmented that your body can never get used it.

On a side note though - I would love to have the freedom to work out 2 hours a day so I really applaud you. Exercise is therapy to me so mentally I get a bunch out of it. However, if I worked out 90 to 120 a day I would be 100 pounds so I think that your body is used to what you are doing are you are no longer getting optimal value out of it if you still have unwanted pounds after all the hours you put into it per week.

 

[RapidBreath]

Well,

It seems like Kathryn, Carola, Clare and the others have said it all. Also, you may want to get tested for a food allergy like wheat, corn, or cow's milk. An allergy can prevent weight loss. I don't recommend using protein powders, they tend to prevent weight loss. To lose weight don't lower your calorie intake, I find that to be counter productive. Try increasing the amount of healthy fats, that should do the trick. I would not suggest doing any cardio for more than 60 minutes per day, as mentioned earlier, there is a hormonal response to extended cardio, these hormones do prevent weight loss. I saw your new rotation, so I won't harp on it, but we just want you to be ok.

Alisha

 

[morningstar]

Hi guys,

Thank you for your thoughts and caring response. I have to admit that I am prone to over-doing things and a sharp slap upside the head can be helpful.

I should clarify that I change my rotation all the time- the type of strength training I do changes weekly, for instance. I move from straight up strength, to circuits with cardio, to lifting heavy, high reps, low reps, etc. I live in Canada, so once the winter hits, my cardio will be changing to power walking and more Cathe will be in there.

For complex personal reasons, I can't really do effective cardio or strength training at home in the morning and I only have two weekdays where I can work out in the evening. I'm sure it seems like I have tons of time to work out, but in fact, this rotation is an attempt to fit my workouts into some pretty tight parameters. Running sprints to work allows me to get in my cardio - I actually am not sure how I'm going to manage to do Cathe cardio in the winter, given my complicated situation. I have been trying to think of a solution.

I work out at home, and a trainer is not a viable option at the moment financially.

I didn't actually say that steady state running was boring (I think Janis said it for me) but that I hate it- and I do!

 

[becky2500]

I would like to lose 20lbs of body fat, maintain muscle, and not have to eat a low-calorie diet to do it.

You don't have to eat a low-calorie diet to lose weight. It looks to me like you do A LOT of cardio, and that's what I would back off on. If you lift more weights and really eat clean, you will reach your goals!

Becky

 

[Janis]

Hi Morningstar,

Did you see this response from Cathe in the ASK CATHE forum? Great information for all of us, plus it is exactly what you have been doing, so it's good confirmation too.


"Just keep shocking your routine and don't let your body get used to a pattern. For example I would vary the intensity of the cardio one week, either vary intensity, amount of days per week, or how long each cardio is per session. Also vary weights, ie: some total body workouts, to 4 day splits, to one week of STS Meso One and then one week of STS Meso #2 (along with 3 days a week of intense cardio). Just keep it changing and make sure you hit all the major muscle groups. Push hard on weights and breath hard on cardio and ABSOLUTELY EAT CLEAN!!!! Good Luck" Cathe Friedrich

 

[clothesminded]

I don't mean this in a rude way, but it seems from your posts that you are very obsessive about your workout plan. I just read the check-in for legs, disc 9 and even there you were asking Cathe if you should put in a circuit workout. You had so much "stuff" in your weekly schedule.

My thought is if you keep doing the same thing, you'll get the same results. So, if you don't like the results, which I'm guessing you don't if you asking (?), then try a different approach. Less really is more, and I can say this because I was like you for so long. Now I have a knee injury and poor body image even though I'm only 106 and what many people would want to look like. Just don't do that to yourself. You have your entire life to exercise. Why cram it all into one month?

JMO

 

[morningstar]

I don't mean this in a rude way, but it seems from your posts that you are very obsessive about your workout plan. I just read the check-in for legs, disc 9 and even there you were asking Cathe if you should put in a circuit workout. You had so much "stuff" in your weekly schedule.

My thought is if you keep doing the same thing, you'll get the same results. So, if you don't like the results, which I'm guessing you don't if you asking (?), then try a different approach. Less really is more, and I can say this because I was like you for so long. Now I have a knee injury and poor body image even though I'm only 106 and what many people would want to look like. Just don't do that to yourself. You have your entire life to exercise. Why cram it all into one month?

JMO

I posted that question to Cathe in March 2009. Two questions about rotations in 4 months- I can see where that could be considered "obsessive". Many people post on these forums about rotations- it's a pretty hot topic around here.

It seems that people think because I've said that a goal is to lose 20lbs of body fat, that I am not happy with my results. Well, my "obsessive", overtraining ways lost me 125lbs over the course of 1 year a couple of years ago.

Due to an incredible amount of stress over a one year period while getting into weight-lifting, I regained 16lbs of body fat (10lbs of which was over Christmas 2008!) while also gaining about 20lbs of muscle. I never stopped working out, but I didn't have a very clean diet during that time.

I regrouped, and since February I have lost 27 lbs of body fat while maintaining my lean body mass at 116lbs. I have a ways to go, but I am very pleased with my results. Quite frankly, I'm in the best shape of my life, even if I weigh a bit more than I did at my lowest point, because my body composition is completely different. I am a lot smaller now, even at a heavier weight. I get complimented about how much weight I've lost, but I am much more interested in how much stronger I have become. I lift very heavy, and I have a lot of stamina.

I respect the people on this forum and their opinions and knew that I could count on them to help out when I was unsure as to whether what I was doing might be a bit harmful.

Please understand, I work out because I love it and it keeps me sane. I would work out even if it never helped me reach any fitness goals. I don't want to overtrain because I don't want to cause damage. I am not an idiot, and I know one helluva lot about fitness and nutrition. Yes, I train too much, but that makes me happy. I used to throw up to be happy- this is a much better life choice.

 

[morningstar]

Hi Morningstar,

Did you see this response from Cathe in the ASK CATHE forum? Great information for all of us, plus it is exactly what you have been doing, so it's good confirmation too.


"Just keep shocking your routine and don't let your body get used to a pattern. For example I would vary the intensity of the cardio one week, either vary intensity, amount of days per week, or how long each cardio is per session. Also vary weights, ie: some total body workouts, to 4 day splits, to one week of STS Meso One and then one week of STS Meso #2 (along with 3 days a week of intense cardio). Just keep it changing and make sure you hit all the major muscle groups. Push hard on weights and breath hard on cardio and ABSOLUTELY EAT CLEAN!!!! Good Luck" Cathe Friedrich

Thanks, Janis! I guess my inability to stick to one rotation works for me!

 

[morningstar]

One thing I am confused by is that people seem to think my regular walks are cardio. My heart rate doesn't go above 65% of max most times during those walks- hardly even a Level 1 Cardio Coach warm up. Sometimes after work, they could even be considered a stroll! They are really not a cardiovascular workout, but still exercise, so I include them in what I do in a week.

 

[Worknprogress]

Morningstar - I hear you on how exercise keeps you sane. I am like you and love to run while the weather is good. As I was saying in my last post - it seemed most of all of your running though was interval running so your body has gotten used to it so you probably are not getting the most out of it anymore. That is why I was suggesting that you change up your running during the week and don't do one same kind of run more than twice.

Try HIIT running - that has put my fitness level up a notch like nothing else. That 20 minutes (of course first my 5 min w/u) of HIIT running is a killer but it is so power packed that after that 20 minutes I can ONLY walk home!!! Of course, I can only do that kind of run early in the morning before people are up and around because I know I look like a freak!!!!

The only other thing I am going to add to my summer running is probably add a 2 hour run about every 2 weeks. I used to do that before my last 2 kids and loved it! But who knows - after having two more kids and tacking on 6 additional years - I may not be able to do it!!!!

And did I read that right - you lost 125 pounds????? Oh my gosh - that is incredible. That is a huge feat and my hat is off to you! You should post before and after pictures!!!

 

[dreamyjeanie]

Morningstar, Just saw the post about the 125lb lost. Congrats! What an accomplishment. High, High, High fives to you.


Jean

 

[twinkletoes129]

Hey Morningstar! I hadn't finished reading all the posts before posting my original reply. So, I'm very proud of you for rejigging your schedule. It looks much more reasonable Ms AMAZON woman!! And 125lb that's AWE-INSPIRING!! Here was my original reply:

I'm so glad your asking this advice and your starting to sense that you may be overtraining. I've been following your blog and I've enjoyed it immensely but have worried that you are overtraining. I LOVE your enthusiasm for exercise and wish I had half the strength and stamina that you have. But sometimes one's strength can be one's weakness if overdone, you know that "yingyang" thingy. So I'm glad that your starting to notice it. All those pesky illnesses is a definite sign that your body's immune system is exhausted and can't maintain itself. After reading your exercise schedule I was shocked that you don't give your body at the very least one day off per week and also the amount you exercise per day of 5 days @ 2.5 hours and 2 @ 3.5 hours. I agree with Gayle, meowracer and pixiesis. Also, kathryn and maddiesmum have come up with some great solutions of making your workouts more beneficial and healthy for your body. I hope you can incorporate their suggestions. Your body needs recovery time and it will also give you more space to change up your schedule to have more time to do other wholistically beneficial things for yourself, like your other hobbies and interests, and more time for friends and family. Exercise is not a means to an end, it's what makes you healthy and fit to do all the other very important things in your life.

 

[morningstar]

Hey Morningstar! I hadn't finished reading all the posts before posting my original reply. So, I'm very proud of you for rejigging your schedule. It looks much more reasonable Ms AMAZON woman!! And 125lb that's AWE-INSPIRING!! Here was my original reply:

I'm so glad your asking this advice and your starting to sense that you may be overtraining. I've been following your blog and I've enjoyed it immensely but have worried that you are overtraining. I LOVE your enthusiasm for exercise and wish I had half the strength and stamina that you have. But sometimes one's strength can be one's weakness if overdone, you know that "yingyang" thingy. So I'm glad that your starting to notice it. All those pesky illnesses is a definite sign that your body's immune system is exhausted and can't maintain itself. After reading your exercise schedule I was shocked that you don't give your body at the very least one day off per week and also the amount you exercise per day of 5 days @ 2.5 hours and 2 @ 3.5 hours. I agree with Gayle, meowracer and pixiesis. Also, kathryn and maddiesmum have come up with some great solutions of making your workouts more beneficial and healthy for your body. I hope you can incorporate their suggestions. Your body needs recovery time and it will also give you more space to change up your schedule to have more time to do other wholistically beneficial things for yourself, like your other hobbies and interests, and more time for friends and family. Exercise is not a means to an end, it's what makes you healthy and fit to do all the other very important things in your life.

Hey Ms. Poster-turned-lurker Twinkletoes, so great to hear from you! Thank you for the kind words- and hey, feel free to kick my rear in a comment to my blog posts! You know how it is when you love to do something- you want to do more, more, more. It's hard to realize when that line is crossed and something you love may now be working against you, just because you took it a bit too far. You know, like heroin!

 

[lcobb2]

Woah. As a personal trainer, I say, yes overtraining for sure. That's a lot of exercise. What are your goals? Dropping weight, leaning out, endorphin rush? That's a lot of cardio. Depending on your goals, you may not be reaching them due to the amount of cardio that you're doing.

Folks, I am feeling like maybe I am overtraining- a few minor injuries, fairly constant small illnesses, that kind of thing. I wanted your opinion, not just as to whether I am overtraining, but if so, how and where I should cut back. I really don't want to overtrain, but truly, my rotation seems reasonable to me and I don't know if I am deluded or on track. Here's my current rotation for 1 week (I stretch after each cardio and strength session):

Monday: 60 minute sprint intervals mixed with walking
50 minute slower walk

Tuesday: 60 minute sprint intervals mixed with walking
50 minute slower walk
60-120 minutes strength circuit (chest/back/abs)

Wednesday: 60 minutes power walking
50 minute slower walk

Thursday: 60 minute sprint intervals mixed with walking
50 minute slower walk
60-120 minutes strength circuit (legs, calves, biceps, abs)

Friday: 60 minute sprint intervals mixed with walking
50 minute slower walk

Saturday: 60-120 minutes strength/cardio circuit (triceps, abs)


Sunday: 60-120 minutes strength/cardio circuit (legs, calves, shoulders, abs)