Pet Vaccine Nightmare!!

chachi

chachi

Cathlete
Please bear with me as I share the last 3 stressful days in our house. I’ve been anxiously waiting to tell you all about this since my DH crashed the computer Sunday trying to install some stuff. I’m hoping that some of you will share your thoughts about this.

Saturday my DH took our two mini dachshunds, Tanner (7 ½ yrs) and Tucker (1yr 3 months) for their vaccinations. He went to a new vet and actually called me during the visit to tell me he wasn’t very impressed since they were very rushed and lacking compassion. Anyways, he gets home and within 5 minutes Tucker started acting really crazy, he was pacing and rubbing the top of his head across the floor. I get a good look at him and his eyes and muzzle were swelling up quickly. I gave him some children’s Benadryl and called the vet and they said that he’s having an allergic reaction and to bring him back up. We were both very upset b/c we’ve never had this happen before with our other dogs. By the time I get there his eyes are almost swollen shut, his muzzle is twice its size and he was starting to have breathing difficulties. After they started him on meds the vet tells me that this allergic reaction happens sometimes especially since it was Tucker’s first round of adult vaccinations. I was so angry b/c if this is common then why didn’t they keep him for 30 min or so after the vaccines just to make sure he was alright. I took him home after about an hour and half with some prednisone he was to take for the next 4 days. At about 11pm (7 hours later) he had another outbreak (swelling and the bit) so we gave him another dose of Benadryl and that seemed to help.

It broke my heart b/c he was so miserable and lethargic. ;(

Sunday he continued to be lethargic and vomited a couple times. Monday he was looking even worse just slept all day and was still vomiting, he also had really bad diarrhea both days (sorry TMI). I started to get really worried when he couldn’t even keep water down. Around midnight he started to vomit blood (twice within a half hour). DH and I had had enough by that time especially after being reassured by the vet that nausea/diarrhea was common and not to be too overly concerned. Well vomiting blood is not common!! We decided to make the 45 minute drive to Michigan Veterinary Specialists where Tanner had his back surgery last year b/c they have a 24hr emergency service and we’ve always been so impressed with their quality of care. I was so worried and in tears of course. They diagnosed him with esophagitis and that he was severely dehydrated. They injected fluids under his skin and gave him some medications to coat his stomach. They sent us home with some meds for the next few days and some low residue canned food. I’ve been feeding him little amounts at a time and he has been keeping it down and his appearance has improved but he has basically slept the whole time. I know that his little body has gone through hell so he needs the rest.

After this ordeal I don’t think I’m ever going to vaccinate them again! How could I possibly risk putting him through this again! I’m just so angry b/c I feel like I allowed this to happen to him…I should’ve been more educated to know the dangers. Saturday night I started doing some searching around the internet and was really freaking out about the info I was reading about vaccines. My DH actually made me get off the computer b/c I was getting so worked up!!

Have any of you ever had an experience like this? Are vaccines really necessary?

Thanks for reading and I’d really appreciate your thoughts on this subject. :)

Chastity

http://www.picturetrail.com:80/chastgirl0205
 
Chastity, I feel so bad for your little guy. I have had mixed thoughts about giving the Vac's every year too and have also read on the internet they are not always necessary. We are required by law to have the rabies shots. I think once they have the puppy shots they do build up a resistance and don't need them in later life unless they are running around loose in the country and could maybe get something from wild animals. Although I realize squirrels and other critters can carry stuff into my yard too. My two ShihTzus are 4 yrs now and I am thinking of not getting them anymore.

Sure hope little Tanner feels better and is back to himself soon. I can only imagine how infuriated I would be, I am angry just reading about your poor baby.

Susan N
 
Chastity,

If your poor baby is having reactions to vaccines I am not sure I would keep him on them unless absolutely necessary. I had a bad experience with a vet who overlooked a bad reaction to an injection from my baby Mollie. It was not her normal vet and the injection was given to treat vomiting and diarrhea. The reaction to the injection caused her tissue to begin dying on her back. It spread really quickly and she of course was rush to Texas A&M's Emergency Vet Hospital. It was absolutely the worst thing I have ever seen, she is lucky to be alive. The surgeons had to remove large sections of tissue on her back and stretch the skin to staple her back up. She was in the hospital for about a month. She has struggled with a few minor staph infections from the surgery but were cleared up with antibiotics. It has been about a year and a half since this happened and she is healthy, happy, very spoiled, and very loved. She is such a special baby. Her vet has recommended not to vaccinate her anymore because it is just too risky. She had received vaccinations prior to this incident and had no problems but it could happen again so I agree that it is just not worth the risk. She never leaves our fenced yard and is not around other animals that are not vaccinated so there is little risk of anything happening to her. My vet informed me that allergic reactions to vaccinations are more common in dashchunds.
 
I have 4 cats and one dog and the only vaccine I do is rabies because it is prescribed by law. I have not vaccinated my pets yearly in I don't know how long. At first my vet disagreed with me but now he agrees. Many years ago a vet friend told me this yearly vaccine thing was just not necessay especially with an older animal who has probably built up some immunity over the years. If in doubt you can always have blood work done to check their levels. Personally (this is not medical advice) but I see it as a scam by these companies. If your pet is having such adverse reactions I wouldn't even consider doing it again. Many holistic vets don't believe in them at all!
 
{{{{hugs}}}} i hope your little guy is doing better. i would yell at the vet for not mentioning this!!!! you didn't allow this to happen to him your vet was just ignorant in helping you understand the reactions of vaccines, that is his job to help his patients!! whether you could find the info online or not is irrelvent. i know when a child gets a new vaccine they go over reactions with me,same should go for pets.

thank goodness you have an ER vet nearby and they were able to help.

kassia

http://www.picturetrail.com/ldy_solana

"And do what thee wilt as long as ye harm none"

http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL1307/4842454/16585805/276676894.jpg
 
I agree. Pets and people should be monitored a full 20 -30 minutes following any vaccination. Any protein, (eaten, injected as in bee stings or touched on the skin or in the eyes)including the ones in vaccines are capable of triggering an allergic reaction including anaphylactic shock in anyone, even those with no prior history of allergic reactions and thus a monitoring period is important but alas many docs and vets don't follow this recommended practice because of the rarity of an allergic reaction.
 
How scary! I'm so sorry both you and Tucker had to go through this! I really hope the little guy is doing much better and that you and DH are starting to be able to relax! It's so terrifying when things like this happen! {{{HUGS}}} to you and Tucker.

My DH gets upset because our vet does charge a lot (like every other vet in my area), but I know he's going to be there when I need him. He's saved Jimmy twice so far (yeah, Jimmy is a very curious, active boy). It's worth it for my peace of mind.
 
That is so scary Chastity!!! I've luckily never had that problem with any of mine. I'm always a little paranoid about it though. Thank goodness he pulled through ok!
 
Thanks ladies...I knew that I would receive some great insight from you all. Tucker is looking a little better today. He has me a little worried b/c I can not get him to drink water. I know that it is probably b/c his throat is sore so I've been giving him ice cubes. Good news is that he has kept everything down...no vomiting :) I can't wait to have my happy tail-wagging boy back. He's been really clingy but I don't mind...lots of snuggle time. Maybe tonight I can sleep in my bed though...I've been sleeping on the couch with him since Saturday night instead of putting him in his kennel.

I agree with many of you now regarding vaccines and the fact that in most cases they simply are not necessary once they are older and have built up a resistance. We keep them leashed in the yard and on walks so I just don't see a reason for it...other than rabies of course. Like I mentioned in my OP I just can't take the risk of this happening again. Having their blood levels checked is definitely a better option from now on.

Shannon, I'm so very sorry that your sweet Mollie had to go through so much...I thought my experience was scary. I'm just glad that she's okay now and very spoiled I'm sure ;) I found it interesting that you mentioned that your vet said that allergic reactions are more common in dachshunds b/c when I was researching info Saturday night the first three sites I visited all had these horrible photos of dogs having allergic reactions and guess what breed all three were? Yup all dachshunds x( That's why I started to get so worked up and DH made me shut the computer down.

Christine, Jimmy is just so gorgeous :) I can relate to having very curious, active boys ;-) I often tell DH that we have the most accident prone dogs!! We've pretty much cleaned out our savings over the past 4 years or so on vet bills but it's so worth it in the end ;) There's no question we'll do anything to make them better when they're hurting.

Liann, I hope your feeling I little better today. I can't believe how long you've been sick :-( Didn't Cheyenne have fluids injected under her skin not too long ago? I have to say that it's a strange thing. Tucker looked like a hunchback and he was leaking for a little while afterwards.

Thanks again everyone...Tucker's is on the mend :)

Chastity

http://www.picturetrail.com:80/chastgirl0205
 
Hi Chastity.

What a rough time you've all had, but I'm glad to hear your pooch is doing better. I have cats, and the only vaccines I get are the rabies/distemper one. I don't even like making them get that shot. I had a cat who got cancer from either the rabies or the leukemia vaccine. After surgury and tons of cancer treatments, he survived for ten more years, but needless to say, he never received another vaccine of any kind. (We kept him indoors, so rabies was never really an issue). As much as I hate to, I still take my other cat (and my new kitten) for the rabies shot. I just check the injection area frequently and very carefully and hope for the best.

Take Care,
Shelbygirl
 
Poor Tucker! I'm glad he's starting to feel better. I have 5 doxies and my Oscar also has allergic reactions to vaccinations. My vet said it's fairly common in dachshunds and it's usually the rabies vaccine that causes it. What works for us is breaking his vaccines into 2 separate vet visits a week apart. Prior to vaccinating they give Oscar a shot of benedryl and wait 15 - 20 min before administering the vaccines. Ever since we've started doing this he hasn't had any allergic reactions. He also gets a 3 yr rabies so he doesn't have to have it every yr.

Oscar is allergic to alot of things. He stuck his nose in a fire ant mound once - OMG - he swelled up like the Elephant man from the tip of his nose to the tip of his tail.

I hope you can find a new vet that will treat your weens with caring and compassion!

http://i9.ebayimg.com/01/i/000/82/0e/dd92_2.JPG
Oscar

Lorrie
http://www.WhatsUpDoxDachshundShoppe.com
 
Chastity - Yes, Chey had a tummy bug a few months back and had to have fluids injected. She did look pretty odd for a few days after that! Also, the area where she had the fluids injected felt kind of "crunchy" for about a week afterwards. I was told that was from air trapped in there? It's normal, so if you pet him and notice that, don't panic. (I did) ;)

I am feeling a little better today. I've talked to a bunch of people who have come down with this bug that just holds on. I really haven't been able to workout much since Christmas and it's really bumming me out! ;)
 
Let me share my recent experience. I have not been active on this board for a long time because last Nov. I took in a stray that ended up being pregnant. Between working and taking care of the pups and my kids I am never on the computer anymore (don't ask about working out :-( ).

I put off getting the pups vaccinations until 8 weeks because, I was ill. Well, they got Parvo, even though they were almost entirely in the house. I know everything about Parvo now! I am the Parvo expert and let me tell you this is nasty stuff. After the first pup got sick I went to a new vet (my old vet has raised his prices through the roof). He gave me some stuff to inject 3x a day and a syringe to force liquids down his throat.($75) He was so sick - diarrhea and vomiting. Looked pathetic - I didn't think he would make it, but he did.

The next pup got sick and was much worse. Got some more meds from the new vet ($35) Couldn't keep any liquids down and bloody diarrhea turned to pure blood. I think a couple of times he passed about close to a cup of pure blood and water. Started having trouble breathing. Took him to my old vet and he said he had pneumonia with the Parvo. He stayed 4 days and has recovered ($400), The last pup did not get it bad, but refused food and had loose stools for a couple days. Now my adult Bichon has thrown up and done diarrhea the past 3 days (not bad but he feels bad) even though he is immunized! The vet could not explain this to me.

Here are some interesting facts about Parvo! Parvo is so contagious that if you pick it up on your shoes and someone walks behind you, your pups can catch it. If you pick it up on your clothes and sit in the car and another person uses the car - they can pass the virus.

I read on the internet that Parvo can stay active in the environment for 9months after the onset, but both vets told me it will NEVER leave my house. I was told I could wash the inside with strong bleach, but there was little I could do for the dirt. This is especially bad, because my mother's dog is not vaccinated (allergic also) and my mom frequently comes and stays with us. Now she never can come again without the danger of him catching it.

A dog passes the virus in his stool for THREE WEEKS after recovering. Here is an important fact I did not know: unless the pup has received the ENTIRE series of vaccinations (I believe this is usually around 14 -16 weeks?) they can still catch Parvo. This has been a nightmare for me and ALL my time after work has been devoted to cleaning up and caring for these pups and the worst is about my mom - I am heartbroken over this.

So, my only advice is to watch your puppy , when they are young (I know yours weren't) because they are not safe until they are finished with the puppy vaccines and it is SO contagious.

I am glad your dog is doing better, it sure is scary to witness a reaction like that. Sorry for being so long - I am so frustrated and exhausted over this! Marnie
 
We had the same thing happen to our pointer, Abby. When she was a pup she was so sickly I didn't think she'd live a year. She's now six and doing great! She was vacinnated in the morning and she had a reaction about 10 hours later. She swelled up and had huge bumps all over her body. We live within five minutes of an emergency vet and as soon as she got a shot of benadryl she slept and was fine. It was really scary when it happens! I'm glad your dog is fine.
Ellen
 
I have not been on the board for a couple of months due to personal issues either but I wanted to respond. I have a lot of empathy for gettingstrong/Marnie, I am VERY SORRY what happened to your pups. My dog had 7 puppies in June 07. Knowing about parvo, I was PARANOID!!! A lot of what Marnie is saying is TRUE! I stopped taking my dogs to the doggie park but took the adult dogs out for walks. Everytime I took my adult dogs out, when I came back I wiped their paws with a weak Clorox solution, everyone that came into my house had to take their shoes off and wipe their feet with the same weak Clorox solution, wipe off their hands BEFORE they got to touch the puppies.

Parvo is HIGHLY contagious! No doubt about that, you get one of your pups infected it just spreads like wildfire! In general puppies are protected by their mothers through nursing IF the mother has been protected - with a lot of rescues that is not the case, they have never once been vaccinated or exposed to the virus to develop antibodies in their life.

Even with a fully vaccinated puppy Mom the problem is to catch the time where the pups are no longer protected through the antibodies from the mother's milk. THAT IS why you vaccinate the pups after they are 6 to 8 weeks old on a 3 to 4 week schedule to make sure they ARE protected.

The problem is, when you vaccinate too early with the vaccines that were commonly used, it doesn't overwrite the maternal antibodies (it basically is just a shot in the blue) which may be too weak to protect but too high to have the vaccine work. You could get into a situation where despite of the vaccine the pups were not protected and actually causing a weakening of the immune system in the pups. The newer (more expensive vaccines) do overwrite the maternal antibodies and are more effective. BUT it is a matter of having done the research and asking your vet, what vaccine ARE you using.

All of that being said, we are not talking about the admittedly highly contagious Parvo on pups but we are talking about repeated booster vaccinations. It is highly unlikely that an adult dog contracts distemper or parvo, just like it is highly unlikely that a child that was vaccinated for MMR (measles, mumps, rubella) or any other childhood diseases will contract those, and we are NOT doing yearly booster shots after the basic immunization.

What makes us think that more of the same would be more effective?? If that was true, we would have to keep immunizing our kids EVERY year.

Chastity,

I am so sorry that Tucker went through this!!!! What a nightmare!!! I am glad that, whereas not totally back to his normal self, he is okay afterall.

Yearly vaccinations have been one of my pet peeves (no pun intended :) ) for many years. I have owned many dogs and cats over the past 25 years. And I have kept their vaccinations to a minimum due to the research that I have done and many adverse reactions that I have heard about.

I stopped doing the yearly "booster shots" about 10 years ago and of the 8 dogs and 10 cats that I have had since then, none of them ever came down with any of the illnesses that you try to prevent with vaccinations. The breeder of the 5 dogs that I have gotten over the past 2 years, only does limited amounts of vaccinations, she has been breeding dogs for 25+ years and for the past 12 years has only done limited vaccinations due to the potential side effects. She has 18 to 23 dogs at any given time (excluding the puppies) and she has never had any problems.

I do make sure (as does the breeder) that he dogs get the first few rounds (3 to 4) of immunizations when they are puppies and MAYBE one additional booster after they turn 1 years old, after that I am done with distemper/parvo, etc. With rabies most of us don't have a choice due to state laws, you'll have to do it and I do, I am not happy about it, but .....

In the last few years, even the American Association of Veterinary Hospitals has put out a recommendation not to vaccinate every year, but instead every 3 years. They even have stated that an argument could be made for LESS vaccination instead of more. But there were also circulated emails and statements that this would impact the livelihood of vets to advocate more than 1 year increments of vaccinations, go figure!!!

For the last 8 or 9 years, my dogs have not gotten any vaccinations, other than their first rounds as puppies and the mandatory rabies, they have not been on any heartworm medication. I do make it a point to have blood tests done for ALL of them EVERY year, including heartworm tests. I am not skimping on the vaccinations and heartworm because I am a cheap skate or want to save, I do this out of conviction based on my research and actually with the approval of my current vet. She is NOT a naturopathic/homeopathic vet!!!

This has worked well for me and my pets. BUT I also don't subscribe to the "regular" pet food and pet manufacturer's claims that is "complete and balanced diet", I have read up on what is in commercial pet food diets and I AM appalled. I don't think many of the diets that are commercially offered are adequate diets for our pet.

I have taken a lot of heat over this subject on this forum and outside of it, and I don't care to go into this and rehash this again. If you want more information on vaccinations and adequate nutrition I would recommend Dr. Pitcairns Complete Guide for Natural Health for Cats and Dogs, or email me directly and I can give you more info or links.

One way or another, I hope your puppies are okay.
 
quote - In the last few years, even the American Association of Veterinary Hospitals has put out a recommendation not to vaccinate every year, but instead every 3 years. They even have stated that an argument could be made for LESS vaccination instead of more. But there were also circulated emails and statements that this would impact the livelihood of vets to advocate more than 1 year increments of vaccinations, go figure!!!



Yes, Carola I read this too! I can't remember where - it was an online version of a newspaper - Pittsburgh maybe. They were saying that 3 years was plenty and that was the recommendation in the Vet's manual thingy (sorry can't remember what its called), but that most were not going by that. Marnie

edited to add: yep it was Pittsburgh. I found the article: http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/07121/782290-338.stm
 
Thanks for posting this link, Marnie!!!

I do run into the problem of not being able to kennel my dogs or take them to some groomers like in PetsMart or PetCo, my vet has written me a note but there are many kennels or groomers who will not accept this note - yet.

I am glad you puppies turned out okay, but I am sure that was quite challenging.

I didn't want to sound condenscending or diminish any problems that people have once parvo gets into their environment. It is HORRIBLE, once you have it and there are young puppies in your house, it can be devasting. My vet told me even with the series of vaccines there is no guarantee, you just try to catch it BEFORE the immunity from their Mom diminishes and noone knows when that happens. A well-immunized doggie Momma in good health will pass on her immunity to the pups, but only for so long and you can't predict when that wears off, that's why they give so many immunizations over a period of several months and now with vaccines that override the antibodies in the puppies systems that they get from their Moms it is a little easier BUT not all vets are using those new vaccines, unfortunately.

But there is not much that you can do to avoid parvo, it can come in by just going for a walk, on the tires on your car, or even a bird flying in you backyard. This had me paranoid for many weeks and people were giving me the 5th degree for having them take their shoes off, wipe their feet and hands.

I hope this didn't come across that I would recommend to not vaccinate at all. I am just a big proponant of less once the puppies get out of the puppy stage for the potential side effects that Chastity described.

Whereas adult dogs CAN get Parvo, it is VERY unlikely, IF they had a series of vaccinations for basic immunization. Just like with kids, even if they get their basic immunizations, they still can come down with any of the childhood diseases that they have been vaccinated against. Unfortunately nothing is 100 % fool proof!

I admire your dedication and your willingness to make sure those puppies were okay. I don't know many people who would have gone through that and would have been willing to spend that kind of money. Did you end up keeping the puppies, or did they go on to live with new families?
 
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